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Subject: Introduction


Author:
Russ
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Date Posted: 17:45:07 09/26/12 Wed

Hello to Voy Forum #229272 from Russ,

The southern climes of the USA, and rather far below the Mason Dixon Line at that, is home. In my late 30s, my wife and I are the parents of two boys: Adam age 8 years and Bruce age 12 years.

It was good to locate both Voy Forums #228811 and #204228 but especially now that this forum is devoted to parents and caregivers I'll be able to approach disciplinary matters with a bit more of an adult emphasis.

Both my wife and I grew up in families in which the father was the primarily disciplinarian; therefore, that aspect of rearing children has become my responsibility. Spanking is wholeheartedly utilized within our household, but most always it is utilized in conjunction with other punishment forms (i.e., grounding, additional household chores, television and computer restrictions,etc.).

Both boys began receiving licks at approximately age five with both the intensity and quantity of their licks age dependent. They respond well to this form of punishment, resent it no more more than any other form of punishment, and since spanking is prevalent in this region of the nation, our boys are in frequent contact with other children that receive lickings at home and paddlings at public school.

I look forward to future parental interaction at this Internet location.

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Replies:
[> Subject: Re: Introduction


Author:
Bob E. to Russ
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Date Posted: 05:12:41 09/27/12 Thu

Russ,

I am glad to see that you have posted here- welcome!

I note with amusement that we both have 8 year-old sons named Adam. I will leave it to them to straighten that out when you allow them to post on Voy # 228811. But our Adam has already been posting there, so there may be confusion. I can talk to my son and see how they might resolve this issue....

I have a couple of questions for you; First, you wrote that, "most always it (spanking)is utilized in conjunction with other punishments." Do you ever use these non-corporal punishments in lieu of spanking, rather than in addition to spanking? Why/why not?

Secondly, when spanking was begun (approximately) at age five with your children, did your wife spank them then, or were they always made to "wait until your father gets home." The reason I bring this up, is that spanking is (at the younger ages, especially) most effective when as closely linked in time to the behavior for which the child is punished. (Having said this, I will add that my Mom NEVER spanked me; it was ALWAYS "wait until your Father comes home.")

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[> [> Subject: Two Answers and One Question


Author:
Russ
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Date Posted: 18:38:04 09/27/12 Thu

Two Answers
"First, you wrote that, "most always it (spanking)is
utilized in conjunction with other punishments." Do you
ever use these non-corporal punishments in lieu of
spanking, rather than in addition to spanking? Why/why
not?" Our family goal is the dual objective of
punishing wrong doing in such a manner that the
likelihood of future disobedience is made less likely.
Spanking is a powerful tool for both objectives, but
certainly it is not the only tool. Much depends upon
the specific disobedience and the circumstances
surrounding that disobedience. If it was a thoughtless
act in which one of the boys simply acted without
thinking then the matter can be handled with a
one-to-one talk. Some disobedience is more premeditated
and best addressed with a stern warning that any
repetition will be met with a licking. Other
disobedience, especially that in direct violation of
established household rules, will merit an immediate
paddling.

"Secondly, when spanking was begun (approximately) at
age five with your children, did your wife spank them
then, or were they always made to "wait until your
father gets home." The reason I bring this up, is that
spanking is (at the younger ages, especially) most
effective when as closely linked in time to the behavior
for which the child is punished." Initially, at
approximately age 5 when spankings were begun, my wife
administered the licks and for the precise reason you've
mentioned --- the importance of immediately linking the
negative behavior to the punishment. If I was home at
the time then I'd assume the role of disciplinarian. As
each boy has now grown older and is able to understand
the concept of disobedience and punishment being
seperated in time I now administer the paddling later in the day upon my return.

One Question
Bob, you've indicated in responses both at this Forum
and other Spank With Love Voy Forums that bare
bottom spankings is your norm when the father (versus
the mother) spanks his son. In a recent response to
Beverly, in fact, you wrote "If your husband is
spanking, however, it must be understood by your husband
and your son that "bare bottom" WILL be the method."
Both my Bruce and Adam frequently take their licks on
their bare bottoms so I'm not at all opposed to this
spanking mode. What I'm wondering, however, is why you
feel so strongly that bareness is important. Is it a
psychological issue? I have vivid memories of my
lickings as a teenage in which I received the paddle
both over my blue jeans and with jeans/under pants down
around my ankles. Very honestly I never experienced
much difference in the intensity of the lickings either
way. Certainly thin briefs or boxer shorts will not
effect the intensity level. Thanks for satisfying my
curiosity.

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[> [> [> Subject: Re: Two Answers and One Question


Author:
Bob E.
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Date Posted: 02:27:08 09/28/12 Fri

No, Russ, I completely agree (and stated myself) that any thin clothing will have negligible cushioning effect of whatever spanking method that's used. In the Behavior Contracts that we had our kids sign, we specified the bare-bottom method of spanking, in order to achieve a consistency across all spankings, and to assure ourselves that we were not "overspanking," i.e., bruising, God forbid. But, we realized that there might be a modesty issue that would present itself at puberty, if my wife were to spank the boys. To "head this issue off in advance," my wife chose an age of ten for allowing the boys to cover with underwear, or pajama bottoms.

In view of the fact that the boys have no qualms about joining me in the sauna, and are not embarrassed when I have encountered them getting dressed, etc., I did not feel that they would care about their bottom being bare for spanking when I spank them. At this point, if they were to raise any objection, I would not hesitate to allow them to cover themselves as they do for my wife. I do suppose there may be some psychological effect of a bared bottom, but it is not one that I need nor really consider as significant.

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[> Subject: Re: Introduction


Author:
Pat to Russ
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Date Posted: 16:35:10 09/27/12 Thu

I agree, I do find that spanking is far more accepted here in the South.

I also find that the boys talk about it among peers here and I know that is not done elsewhere.

Are your sons open with it with their peers? I assume their peers get "whuppins" too?

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[> [> Subject: Russ Back To Pat


Author:
Russ
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Date Posted: 19:10:13 09/27/12 Thu

Hey, Pat --- it's good to 'see' you here. I'm relatively new myself but I'll also extend the Welcome.

You're certainly correct about a greater Southern acceptance of spanking than elsewhere. Yet even here there is an ever increasing resistance to the administration of the Scriptural rod. What's happening in our little Southern corner is larger public school districts with their associated parental constituents outlawing corporal punishment while less metropolitan areas continue down the traditional path. We are pleased to be in an area where all of the parents we know, as well as all of the school dictricts, utilized the paddle as needed.

You asked if my boys talk about "whuppins" - to use your wording - with their friends. Of course I'm not privy to their private conversations, but there are definite suggestions that they do even as I and my buddies use to talk about the lickings we got both at home and at school. The 12 year old seems to be considerably more interested that the 8 years old since he (the older boy) freqently mentions at a meal table that Billy or Joey, etc. got a paddling earlier that day in school. That provides an excellent opportunity to ask why the paddling was necessary and then explore why the disobedience that occasioned it is so disruptive to the educational process.

I'm looking forward to your thoughts and comments on this Forum.

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[> [> [> Subject: Re: Russ Back To Pat


Author:
Pat to Russ
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Date Posted: 10:50:35 09/28/12 Fri

The school our boys attends is a private school and does use corporal punishment. It is not always the go to punishment but it is certainly an option. All of my boys have all had their turns (several times) bent over in the principal's office.

I live near Nashville. Davidson County (Nashville) outlawed corporal punishment five years ago but there is now a push to bring it back as behaviors are out of control. My county still allows it in the public schools but it is not used very much.

We use spanking, although not exclusively anymore as the boys are getting older. All of their friends are also subject to it.

I do have a question and that is about Double Jeopardy. In other words the rule that says spanked at school = spanked at home. Have your boys ever been paddled at school? If so, did you spank again at home?

Russ, I used to not do this but, when PJ was in ninth grade and Caleb was in eighth they got out of control. For some reason they lost respect for the school paddle. I overheard PJ tell Caleb, "Just go ahead and do it, it'll only cost a few licks." I did not let the boys know I heard. Karen and I were already concerned that the boys were getting in more trouble than normal for them so we made a decision. The next week, PJ was paddled for being in an unauthorized area. He specifically pulled his girlfriend in a teacher's workroom to kiss her and they got caught. He proudly told me about it when he got home (although I already knew as the principal and I were friends.) Imagine his surprise when I spanked him long and hard. Caleb got his double jeopardy from me the next month. The boys' behaviors really turned around. It wasn't flawless and they did get more than they should have that year but I think it helped.

I still have the rule but I reserve the right to not spank again if I feel the boy is contrite and learned his lesson and the school's punishment was effective. Only Mark has been paddled this year. He skipped class, left campus and went to a fast food joint for lunch. (He drives.) The principal just happened to be having lunch at the same place when Mark stepped in line to order. Russ, they actually ate together. He was paddled. Karen felt the incident was a little too blatant and so she spanked him again at home. (I was out of town.) He also lost his privilege to drive to school for a week.

Anyway, I feel the double jeopardy rule works. I would appreciate your thoughts.

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Pat's Double Jeopardy


Author:
Russ
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Date Posted: 18:13:46 10/02/12 Tue

Pat,

Within your Friday, September 28 post you asked if my boys have been paddled at school and, if so, are they again spanked at home. Within that post's concluding remarks you added the conlusion that a ". . . double jeopardy rule works."

My younger son has not yet experience the paddle at school but his older brother has taken licks outside the classroom in the hallway and bent over his principal's desk on several occasions. A "Discipline Report" is send home with each student punished in any form (detention hall, additional assignments, paddling, etc.) during the day. Parent are requested to read, sign, and return this form the following morning with the boy or girl. Whenever Bruce is punished he and I meet to review his Discipline Report following the evening meal. He's given opportunity to explain what happened and is encouraged to offer his view of the circumstances. We've found his school administrator and teachers to be extra patient and fair; nonetheless, Bruce is given every opportunity to defend himself.

Do I spank after reviewing a Discipline Report? Yes, Sir; you bet that I do. And at least a couple of reason explain my pracice.

First, Bruce and Adam have heard us repeatedly state that both Mom and Dad view the public school as an extention of their parental authority. It is solely our responsibility to educate our boys yet the nature of modern society requires that we request the assistance of non-family members to help us with our reponsibility. The public school is the agency that we have selected to help with our educational goals. As a result, disobedience during the school day is just as much an affront against us as it is against teachers, principals, coaches, etc. A paddling at school allows punishment to be administered rapidly following Bruce's disobedience. The licking that I adminster later that evening is several hours removed from his disobedience. It demonstrate, however, that parents and school personnel stand united in a refusal to tolerate noncompliance.

Secondly, home lickings following school paddlings are hopefully a way to counter the cavalier attitude toward the paddle that teenage boys sometimes develop. [Hey, look, Pat, I once was a teenage boy myself taking licks at school and feeling pretty macho about it. My paddlings sometimes even became the bragging right among my buddies!] The goal is to help Bruce understand that if he thinks he'll use his school's paddle to feel macho then he'll do so at the peril of the spanking strap that he'll recive later that evening. I still have vivid memories of how my Dad's strap kept me rather humble with my buddies after getting the paddle at school, and for certain it made it lots more difficulty for me to feel either macho and/or cavalier about any of it.

Hope these thoughts are of value for you and your sons. Like you, I know for certain that the Double Jeopardy Rule accomplishes everything (and even more) that is intended.

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