Snapshot: Lenny Brown vs. Lionel Chalmers -- XAVIER MENS BASKETBALL

[ Show ]

Support VoyForums

[ Shrink ]

VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: [1], 2, 3, 4 ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 13:02:39 09/05/02 Thu
Author: Snipe
Subject: Snapshot: Lenny Brown vs. Lionel Chalmers

Lenny Brown was a soph in 95-96. It was his second year as a starter. Here are some of his stats:
FG% 42.6%
3 Pt FG% 33.7%
FT% 70%
Rebounds 3.8
PPG 15.6
Assists 3.5

Lionel "L-Train" Chalmers was a soph last year. It was his first year as a starter, though he had significant minutes the year before. Here are some of his stats:
FG% 42.1%
3 Pt FG% 35.1%
FT% 71.9%
Rebounds 3.4
PPG 12
Assists 4.2

To me, these numbers look very similar. The two players played with different players, different coaches, and different systems. Brown didn't have West and Sato, but Posey and Williams were excellent players. Brown's team was probably more high octane, and he was probably counted on to do more of the scoring than would be expected of LC. Another obvious point is that LC has played point, and that Brown only played point to spell Lumpkin.

I don't know what you guys think, but I think that Lionel Chalmers is by far the most overlooked player on this roster. Lenny Brown was a great ball player for us, and it looks to me that LC could be as good or even better.

The biggest reason for our success may not be David West or Romain Sato. Those guys are known players. They are both on the Wooden list. The biggest reason for our Final Four run may well be the coming out year for one Lionel Chalmers. Scouts coming to games to rate Sato and West may well being saying who in the hell is that guy to each other in the stands.

They say the point guard is the most important position on the court. The biggest game we ever won was the Sweet 16. Despite the twin NBA towers of Hill and Strong, Jumpin Jamal Walker was the game MVP.

Lionel will split the point with Finn, and also slide over to play some 2 guard. His contribution to this team is critical to our Final Four run. LC is going to come up big, and I am talking huge. Do not deny the L-Train.

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> I agree with your solid analyses. I love how Lenny sunk UC with the infamous shot & how LC sunk Toledo with his last second beauty. Lenny will alway be a favorite of mine. Yet, I think LC plays more "in control" and will lead us to the elite 8. I wonder what LB & LC similar turnover ratios were/are? -- NO JUSTCE! NO PEACE!, 13:45:10 09/05/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> I don't have Brown's turnover numbers offhand. Maybe somebody can find them. It would be interesting to find out. I like your point about last second shots. Both of those guys want the ball, they don't shy away from taking a shot. Ice in the veins, cold blooded shooters and all that. That is what I want in a player. I believe that you are right about LC leading us to the Elite Eight. That will happen one game before he takes us to the Final Four. Looks like The Cartel might have to invade New Orleans for that game. I heard it is a good place to raise hell. -- Snipe, 14:02:21 09/05/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> I think your points are strong. In your reply you mentioned what I was wondering: turnovers. My only gripe with LC is that he isn't really much of a point guard. I think of him as a 1.5 guard. He is a point guard who seems to think his role is to score. And I will not be overly critical of him, becuase it is his scoring that is easily his best asset. I would prefer to see more assists and less turnovers, even if it meant he didn't score quite as much. -- XU Fan, 14:23:41 09/05/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> I actually think your post proves an earlier position I held: Lionel would be more effective as a two with only some time at the point. Unfortunately, unless Finn turns into a stud real fast, I don't see Lionel getting that opportunity this year. -- Homeskillet, 13:16:25 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> my very inside sources tell me that Finn might not be the real deal we had heard/hoped... -- Pablo, 13:40:12 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> That is not good. I thought he had a good summer league. -- Holden Wilson, 18:53:37 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Every player has his strengths and weaknesses. Lionel has room for improvement in many areas, but he is already a very well rounded player. People have complained about every point guard that we have had since Stan Kimbrough. Jamal might have been our best, and even the coaches constantly complained about him. PG's have it tough. Most players are remembered as seniors. (Cont) -- Snipe, 14:23:32 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> LC has the tools to penetrate and make his own shot. He has a great outside shot. He has explosive quickness. He has all the raw physical tools. If he could find a way to average one more assist and one less turnover per game, his ratio would be better than 2:1. It will be interesting to see how he develops this year. Lenny Brown is a Xavier great, the point of this post I guess is that LC is one too. -- Sniper, 14:23:58 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> Are you the same guy that doted on Young as the next phenom? Take a position and stick with it. At the end of the year, you'll be saying 'I told you so' regardless of who carries them. -- DonalD, 13:52:40 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> I don't have 1 just one guy, I root for all 13. I will put together a post about David Martin Young next week. I am sure that you will be waiting with much anticipation. Nice to have you on the board. -- Snipe, 14:15:22 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> Lenny and Lionel have very similar games. I think that Lionel is quicker though, and will end up a better shooter. I think that he has more upside. Lenny Brown was a hell of a player though. He was a gamer. That is what I like about both of them. -- Holden Wilson, 18:56:37 09/06/02 Fri

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> LC just may have more upside. If he turns it on this year could be scary. -- Snipe, 19:02:42 09/09/02 Mon

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> Mugshot....Lenny Brown vs Lloyd Price -- Simon Lease, 08:05:30 09/09/02 Mon

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Clever, if you could spell. LC will steer this team to the elite 8, with the twin-turbo engines of David West and Romain Sato. -- BP, 11:58:38 09/09/02 Mon

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> It was a joke, you dik. -- Leis, 13:43:22 09/09/02 Mon

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> No, jokes are funny. "Simon Lease" is ignorant. -- BP, 14:08:28 09/09/02 Mon

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> [> Funny - you think that UC fans would be quite familiar with the spelling of our local law enforcement... -- Pablo, 15:26:20 09/09/02 Mon

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> Waaaaaaaghghghhhhhhhhhhhh! Mommy! Why does everyone think X fans are whingers? -- Hush, now. It's easy; we are., 07:04:10 09/10/02 Tue

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Here is the thing - please post this mis-spelled drivel on the smack board - the link is above - either that or learn to spell genius. -- Pablo, 07:54:20 09/10/02 Tue

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> What the hell is a whinger anyways? -- Pablo, 07:54:40 09/10/02 Tue

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> I think it's an offensive position in soccer. -- Keltic, 11:28:25 09/10/02 Tue

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> [> I thought it was a heavy metal band. -- Debra Winger, 11:54:12 09/10/02 Tue

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> When Lenny Brown played, the A-10 was stronger. Lionel is playing against poorer competition. Lenny was more of a threat. -- xukeith, 22:31:29 09/11/02 Wed

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Keith, the A-10 was weaker last year than it was then, and that is a point well taken. It helps that we were playing in the strong division of the A-10 last year, vs. playing in the weak division when Lenny was here. I would tell you some historical SOS comparisions, but Jerry Palm is now requiring a membership at college RPI. I may have to stick with Rosie Palm instead. Lenny was a hell of a player, one of my all time favorites. He was a major threat to go off every time he played. Good to see you here Keith. -- Sniper, 11:29:24 09/12/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> When Lenny Brown played, the A-10 was stronger. Lionel is playing against poorer competition. Lenny was more of a threat. -- xukeith, 22:31:30 09/11/02 Wed

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> I move for an xukeith free board. At least one of these xukeith's has to go. -- Homeskillet, 09:42:15 09/12/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> P.S. I am gay. -- X-Bland, 10:30:44 09/12/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]

[> A whinger is a British term, properly spelled, that means a whiner. Will depart for smackville. -- Thad, 08:00:17 09/12/02 Thu

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[ Edit | View ]