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Date Posted: 23:58:13 05/26/06 Fri
Author: Dolora Zajick
Subject: Re: SPIRITUALITY vs. RELIGION
In reply to: Michael 's message, "Re: SPIRITUALITY vs. RELIGION" on 22:58:48 08/02/04 Mon

>>Is it possible that there could ever be a
>>co-exsistence between the Pipe and christianity?

I personally have
>grown from listening to those who would share thier
>native beliefs with me and reading about people like
>Black Elk among others I have read about

Black Elk was a great and holy man. It is not easy to be given a great vision like he was given. A great vision may take a whole lifetime to understand it's deepest meanings, and the fruit of the vision which is passed onto the people may not come until the one who recieved it has long passed onto the next existance. He was an honest man who cared deeply for his people, and wanted to do right by them. It was why he was so tormented and torn, but ultimately he understood the spirit of dogma rather than the letter of it. I believe the tree will bloom, and that the hoop among many hoops will endure.
I also believe that Jesus followed the good red road right up to the cross, and I am sure that the people who comitted atrocities in his name will fulfill his prophesy that not all who call on his name will gain entry into his father's kingdom, Only those who fed and clothed their neighbor when they were hungry and naked, and visited them when they were ill, dying or in prison, those who transalted compassion into action.
I also believe that Jesus would have honored the peace pipe, and would have been pleased that many Native Americans already honored his father in their own way. Jesus was not a fundamentalist dogmatist. Other people created that. I believe that each person must worship God according to his conscience, and I will take a kind honest athiest any day over a Bible thumper who who spouts dogma but lets his neighbor starve. That is why I respect other people's beliefs.
An interesting note in regard to Vine Deloria's "God is Red" Though I prefer the wise and kind Black Elk to the raging Vine Deloria, Deloria had a point when he said that God was red. The first civilzation, the ancient Sumerians, 7,000 years ago in what is now Iraq called the first man Adapa which means "red clay" because according to legend was created from red clay. Adama is the Hebrew version of Adapa. Adam is derived from Adama. Therefore according to the oldest written records and the Bible and if one is to believe the Bible, if man was made in God's image, then God must be red. I don't believe in a literal Adam and Eve, but the symbology is important. All human beings on the Earth are descended from one man and one woman, but they lived thousands of years apart. At some point there were about 200 people who had both their genes, and all the rest of the humans on the planet were wiped out by a catastrophe, probably when a super volcano called Toba in Indonesia blew. For those interested in this you can go to Nationalgeographic.com and click on the genographic project.

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