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Date Posted: 16:33:26 01/22/02 Tue
Author: Rev Gadfly
Subject: Re: Wayne H. Aaland
In reply to:
ALAN
's message, "Wayne H. Aaland" on 05:01:56 01/22/02 Tue
RevG
I must agree with you again Alan. Wayne just emailed me an apologetic by his pastor attempting to impose the Christian view that all have sinned by pulling verses of Isaiah out of context. It matters not in the least if Isaiah said humanity sins, for Isaiah isn't the context of the Book of Job.
If Wayne had a Tanakh, he would realize the problem in a minute; instead he wastes his time on the Old fictional Testament.
As for Isaiah, I will discredit him with one of his own prophecies:
Isaiah 19: 21-22, "21 Thus the Lord will make Himself known to Egypt, ... They will worship the Lord with sacrifice and
offerings, ...22 And the Lord will strike Egypt ... so they will return to the Lord, and He will respond to them and heal them."
This is a false prophecy by a false prophet. Why?
Because Egypt never worshipped YHWH! If they never worshipped YHWH, then they cannot RETURN to something they never worshipped -- just like a man cannot return to a wife he never had. The idea that they would return to the Jewish god is utterly false; for it would mean that they had previously worshipped the Jewish God to this prophecy being made. As for Christians and their ridiculous apologetic that Egypt was christian, this can be dismissed twice over: 1) Christianity is not a religion about offering sacrifices, which this prophecy was about; and 2) Egypt was never christian! A few christian monks living in the desert, and a minority living in the city of Alexandria [by this rationalization, Egypt was also Zoroastrian], does not change the fact that the vast majority of the people
remained pagan , and were found still worshipping Ra by the Muslims. This prophecy requires the offering of sacrifices, in short animal sacrifices as practiced by Judaism. One should keep in mind, that according to chapter 19 v. 11 Zoan has princes, Egypt a Pharaoh, v. 13 Memphis has princes; so the timing for the fulfillment of this prophecy was while those conditions existed. Well, they no longer exist, and this prophecy failed.
Before Wayne listens to his pastor, he better realize that Isaiah's words are worthless and of no more value than the words of Joseph Smith.
peace
Rev Gadfly
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Re: Wayne H. Aaland -- ALAN, 18:50:59 01/22/02 Tue
ALAN: Well said RevG. Wayne doesn't know who his real friends are. You are telling him the truth, giving chapter and verse, and a detailed explanation of why the prophecy fails, and still he listens to his pastor who wants to lie via worthless apologetics. I agree that Isiahs words are no more worhtwhile than Joseph Smith.
One good thing is that Wayne has stuck around. Most Chrisitnas would have either called us names and ran for the hills, or started babbling. Wayne is to be congratulated for sticking it out this long.
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The misnomer of prophecy -- Paul Angle, 02:07:35 01/23/02 Wed
Isn't it rather expected apologists don't ever mention the prophecies in the Bible which did not come to pass, they back step and try and claim they are still to come. Does anyone have a list of these, I know of about 3 off the top of my head. The one about Egpyt being desolate for 40 years with no occupants and the Nile river drying up is a major one that did not occur. I see this sort of reasoning applied to the real Jewish prophecies of their messiah that Jesus failed to fulfill. The Apologists will claim, they are future happenings but it is well known these are the signs of the messiah to happen upon the appearence of the messiah, as proof of the messiah promised to the Jews by God. Ever seen the apologist list of Christian Jesus' prophecies, they aren't even prophecy, not even vage references to Jesus, Moses strikes a rock in the desert as God commands for water for the people and presto its really about Jesus!! Jesus becomes the rock, and the metaphors begin to fly. By that reasoning I can claim they are about me and events in my life. That isn't prophecy, that's projecting metaphors where there are none.
One also fails to realize that the Bible claims prophecy that comes true is of God and those that don't are false or mistaken. Anyone see the bandaid on that reasoning? How long is the time period in question? Are we to think some desert tribal religious fanatic actually predicted a future event 2,500 years later? The New Testaments claims of Jesus have not come to pass in 2,000 years it seems to me these are false claims and prophecies. Especially when we can establish at the time of writing they thought his return to be imminant.
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http://www.infidels.org/library/magazines/tsr/1995/3/3proph95.html -- see this URL for a nicely done list of failed prophecies, 05:40:54 02/25/02 Mon
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