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Date Posted: 18:22:06 04/24/06 Mon
Author: Dee - the real Deel
Subject: Re: free will or predetermination?
In reply to: earth tone son 's message, "free will or predetermination?" on 02:17:01 04/24/06 Mon

>oftentimes you hear that a persons actions are borne
>of their free will; would that then perpetually refute
>the equally often spoken notion that God knows your
>actions before you do? if this contradiction in states
>of cause and effect exists, how do we know what is
>divine or of the will of the flesh?

very good questions earth tone son
btw i am glad you have stuck around regardless of the assinine, ignorant, wayward remarks that have plagued this forum
i look forward to sharing more on these subjects and not the obtuse, backward thinking and base level existence that seems to entrance certain people and turn them into animals
but that seems the reason why we are here discussing this now which would lend credence to the free will and predetermined theories

i believe there'd be more than one angle on these beliefs
for one, an agnostic who by nature neither denies or accepts a typified religious monotheistic diety
would perhaps believe that fate or destiny plays a role
or that everything is based on individual perception and that individual could interpret "signs" whichever way they saw fit

two a person of faith would likely believe that for
starters, and i quote, with the assumption that God exists outside of our universe; not contained with the constraints of our humanly spacetime; then define something predetermined as events that are directly caused by God's interaction with spacetime
miracles could be considered predetermined events, with God's greater ability to do such works conveyed by being capable of working on all 11 dimensions (that humans are, so far, only aware of imo)
if this were the case at any rate you would still have unexplained phenomenon or the existance of the paranormal which the bible or most religious texts offer in abundance and would rule out any scientific explanations for deviances from "normal" perceptions

to test whether the idea is feasible we'd first need to discover a way to run tests on the natural properties making up the dimension of time and spacetime and see how it interacts with the spiritual realm where God resides

this is where the line becomes divided between the previous viewpoints of faith and agnosticism by atheism
however there is a new movement of scientifically minded people who are neither classified as agnostic, atheist nor religious pursuers who define all of the above as the material realm or matter coexisting in harmony with the immaterial, the spiritual or anti-matter
the atoms, and molecular structures of everything we perceive plus what we don't perceive IS all actually interrelated with its creator and is meant to be the great mystery we are meant to discover and "evolve" in understanding of it's inner workings
i feel for one i fit into this latter category
so my opinions will reflect that

i'll go more into detail on my opinions if you are interested
but it's only fair to give you a chance to share what you think, so what do you think?

c ya later! :)

-Dee

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