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Date Posted: Sat, Jun 30, 02:47:58pm CST
Author: Jason Abbott
Author Host/IP: NoHost / 207.41.42.69
Subject: Re: Hall of Fame Question
In reply to: Perry 's message, "Re: Hall of Fame Question" on Sat, Jun 30, 07:54:39am CST

>>>>>>>>Howdy everyone! I was going over the yearbook
>for
>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>umptenth time and was wondering a couple of
>>>>things.
>>>>>>>>Hopefully this is not an out of line question,
>>I'm
>>>>>>not
>>>>>>>>trying to start trouble, I'm just ignorant of
>the
>>>>>>>>answers. I noticed a dog owned by Mr. Keeter,
>>>>>>>>"Cassie" had won the World Hunt three times but
>>>was
>>>>>>>>not in the Hall of Fame. I was wondering why
>and
>>>>>>what
>>>>>>>>is the criteria to get a dog in the Hall of
>>Fame?
>>>>>>>>Since I don't know all the dogs in the Hall of
>>>Fame
>>>>>>>>are there dogs that are only Big Game Leopards
>>>from
>>>>>>>>out west in the Hall of Fame? Just curious.
>>Also
>>>>>is
>>>>>>>>the World Hunt at the same place and time each
>>>>>year.
>>>>>>>>I'd love to attend someday. Thanks for any
>>>>thoughts
>>>>>>>>or information. Fred
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Opps, computer glich, sorry for the multiple
>>>posts!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Fred, In answer to your questions, Cassie is in
>the
>>>>>>Hall of Fame. All dogs that win the world hunt or
>>>the
>>>>>>little world hunt are automatically in the Hall of
>>>>>>Fame. Besides these hunt champions, dogs are
>>elected
>>>>>>into the hall of fame for various reasons. The
>only
>>>>>>set criteria is that a dog must be deceased before
>>>it
>>>>>>can be elected into the hall of fame. Some dogs
>are
>>>>>>elected because of their hunting abilities,
>>>>>>reproducing abilities or various other reasons.
>For
>>>a
>>>>>>dog to be nominated for the hall of fame, someone
>>>>from
>>>>>>that State section must nominate the dog at a
>world
>>>>>>hunt meeting and be voted on. Maybe there should
>be
>>>>>>more criteria for dogs to be elected, but I don't
>>>>>>think there is anything written in the past world
>>>>hunt
>>>>>>meeting minutes that sets the criteria other than
>>>the
>>>>>>world hunt and little world hunt winners, upon
>>their
>>>>>>death are automatically elected. Sometimes in the
>>>>>>yearbook, some of the hall of fame dogs are left
>>>out,
>>>>>>this is just an oversight by whomever is getting
>>the
>>>>>>yearbook ready for print. I don't know of any big
>>>>game
>>>>>>dogs that have been nominated.
>>>>>>The world hunt in not in the same place every
>year,
>>>>>>but most of the time it is on the same weekend
>each
>>>>>>year. It is decided at the world hunt meeting each
>>>>>>year where the next hunt will be held. Any state
>>>that
>>>>>>wants to offer to host the world hunt should make
>>>>that
>>>>>>offer at the meeting and it will be voted upon by
>>>the
>>>>>>members present. Hope this answers your questions
>>>>>>satisfactorily. Dan N
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks Dan, sure does, I really appreciate the
>>>>>response. I was hoping it didn't appear I was
>>trying
>>>>>to stir up any hard feelings. Looks like there are
>>>>>none to stir up. :o) Looks like some of these big
>>>>>game hunters should start nominating some of these
>>>>>outstanding dogs. Where is next year's hunt going
>>to
>>>>>be? Thanks again! Fred
>>>>
>>>>Fred, Next year's hunt will not be set up until the
>>>>2007 world hunt meeting. This year's hunt will be in
>>>>Tilden, Illinois. Watch for the ad in next month's
>>>>Full Cry. Dan N
>>>
>>>There is something I would like to share regarding
>the
>>>hall of fame. Just a personal experience that made
>me
>>>wish that there were a few more requirments for
>>>getting into the hall of fame. Befor I ever owned a
>>>good Leopard, (and I have owned more than one good
>>>one), I was given access to many years of old year
>>>books. I poored over these year books with great
>>>interest and looked at the lists of hall of fame dogs
>>>with great reverence. Then I attended a world hunt.
>>>In the hunt, I could see that a decent dog having a
>>>decent night could win the hunt if he got into some
>>>coon.
>>> I attended the meeting at the world hunt, and
>>>at that meeting a dog was nominated for the hall of
>>>fame. The room was completely quiet. There was no
>>>discussion. As I remember it with my imperfect
>>>memory, it was simply put to a vote. All those in
>>>favor say Aye. OK now all those apposed....(complete
>>>quiet). Well the Ayes have it. I saw people look
>at
>>>each other like something had just happened but I
>>>could not interpret what it was. I felt a little bit
>>>ripped off myself because I had no Idea what made the
>>>dog a great dog. No one said anything about his
>>>accomplishments as a hunter or as a stud dog.
>>>Nothing. I was a member at the time, but could not
>>>offer a vote because I knew absolutely nothing about
>>>the dog. And it all happened so fast, like a
>speeding
>>>train down the railroad.
>>>
>>>Honestly, I was in disbeleif, because I had looked at
>>>that list of great dogs with so much reverence, and
>>>just assumed that they had to go through a lot of
>>>scrutiny, discusion, and consideration.
>>>
>>>
>>>I will also share that if I had thought the dog was
>>>unworthy, I would have felt very intimidated to have
>>>voted out loud against the dog in a room full of
>>>people, with the one who nominated the dog in full
>>>veiw. I already know how people feel about these
>dogs
>>>some times, and I also already know that some people
>>>may feel a dog is a good dog, and the dog would not
>>>meet my criteria for a good dog. I knew nothing
>about
>>>the dog, so that was not an issue. But if I had
>known
>>>about the dog and felt it was not deserving of the
>>>hall of fame, I would have had a hard time voting
>"no"
>>>in front of everyone. It would feel to me the same
>as
>>>openly picking a fight.
>>>
>>>When I found out the dog had been nominated by it's
>>>owner or something like that, I felt even further
>>>disapointed and further disillusioned by the list of
>>>hall of fame dogs. So now I am looking at this list
>>>of hall of fame dogs wondering how many of them had
>>>been nominated by their owner, and put to an open
>vote
>>>in front of the owner, where no one would feel very
>>>comfortable about voting no.
>>>
>>>I dont even know the name of the dog, and it doesnt
>>>really matter to me any more. But I would like to
>>>suggest that if you want to build more respect for
>the
>>>breed as a whole, that there be more of a criterion
>>>for the hall of fame. If the criteria includes a
>>>vote, the voters be informed of the dog's abilities
>>>and accomplishments as a hunter and reproducer, and
>>>that the vote be by secret ballot. I will give my
>own
>>>personal opinion that winning one of these hunts ONE
>>>time would not constitute a hall of fame dog.
>Winning
>>>three times, now that would mean something to me.
>>>
>>>We all know that some years one or both of the hunts
>>>mentioned, for whatever reason, are not well
>attended.
>>> If coon are not moving, only one or two dogs might
>>>even get to come in with plus points. I have been to
>>>enough competition hunts to finish out a couple UKC
>>>night champions, and I know as well as you do that a
>>>very average dog can easily be the only one to come
>in
>>>with plus points on certain nights and in certain
>>>situations, and often, it is not the best dog in the
>>>hunt.
>>>
>>>I am not a member, dont own a dog, and dont deserve
>to
>>>be heard. But here is an outsider's opinion on
>>>another issue regarding these dogs that I feel are
>>>worthy of some respect. I feel that if you want them
>>>to be taken seriously, the systems of recognition
>need
>>>to be something that can be taken seriously when
>>>someone looks into them. "Hall of Fame" should mean
>>>something, even if you only get one dog every five
>>>years or so that shows himself so obviously
>>>outstanding that his inclusion will be obvious.
>Maybe
>>>the dog that was "inducted" at the hunt I attended
>was
>>>just such a dog. I hope so. But there is nothing
>>>about the process that would make me think so.
>>David, Sorry to all the other readers out there but I
>>have to say this, Is their ANYTHING about the ALCBA
>>INC that you do like?? If I felt as negative about an
>>association as you seem to about the ALCBA Inc or any
>>other organization I believe I would distance myself
>>from it as far as possible. I just had to get this off
>>my chest!! Some folks are just prone to looking at the
>>glass 1/2 empty. Perry Lambert,
>In case you could not tell I was a little worked up
>over David's post. He has every right to his
>opinion!!But as facts go I am not aware of any of the
>World Hunts that I have attended a person nominating
>their own dog?? Ronnie Rushing put it quite well in
>the 1999
>year book on page 2. "Hopefully it is understood by
>all that an outstanding dog to one person may be
>average to someone else. This is a touchy issue, with
>no clear cut guidelines."I have heard a great deal of
>grumbling lately from a few fellas about how things
>should be done. I have heard very little in the way of
>just exactly in detail how to get these things done. I
>have read over the by laws and can find no promise
>from the ALCBA Inc. to please everyone! As far as the
>World hunt winner having a decent nite and winning. It
>takes a little more than that. First they must make
>the first nites run off and make the top 16. Second
>nite consists of 4 cast in a 1 hour hunt. Now in a 1
>hr hunt a dog and handler needs to operate pretty
>exact to have an opportunity to win their cast. In
>only 1 hour it is difficult to make up for mistakes.
>Next is the final 4. At this point a dog has done well
>enough to make the final 16, won their cast on the
>second go round and now needs to win another cast to
>be hunt winner. In my opinion it takes more than just
>a decent nite!! I don't care where you hunt and what
>registration it is in. All you have any power to
>control is against the dogs in your cast.
>As for David's implication that the vote was rushed
>through concerning the HOF dog?? Well I have chaired
>the last several meetings. I feel sufficient time is
>given to any topic that makes it to the floor for
>discussion. I try not to waste time in these meetings.
>I make an agenda to help us get the necessary things
>performed and make sure anyone with an additional
>topic has the opportunity to present it. Folks I try
>to refer to my glass as 1/2 full. Thank you and I hope
>to see all of you at the world hunt, Perry Lambert

>I do think dogs should be nominated for the HOF but I don't think it should be voted in by the members.I think the board of directors should have to vote who gets in and who doesn't.I don't think a dog should get in just by being a good dog either.I think you should be able to nominate a dog any time by calling a board member.Reason why is because not everybody can make it out to the hunt.Dogs that should be in there should be good reproducers,or have something that puts them above the rest.Theres probably a lot of dogs that should be in there but isn't because no one was there to nominate them.I can think of several dogs that should be in there like C.V.Hobo,C.V.Tig but there not because no one was at the hunt to nominate them.Theres no way they shouldn't be in there they were great reproducers.The reason their not in there is because who there owner was which shouldn't have anything to do with it.I like all Leopards no matter what bloodline or who the owner is if the dog deserves it put them in there.I know for a fact theres dogs in there that shouldn't be and the reason I know is because the owner said the dog shouldn't be in there.I will not say who or the dog but if someone wants me to I will call the owner and ask if I can.This is what I think of the HOF.Jason

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Replies:

  • Re: Hall of Fame Question -- Mikerich4, Sat, Jun 30, 03:37:37pm CST
  • Re: Hall of Fame Question -- Perry, Sun, Jul 01, 08:43:00am CST
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