VoyForums
[ Show ]
Support VoyForums
[ Shrink ]
VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, 2, 3, [4] ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 16:08:13 05/26/07 Sat
Author: Samir to George Cox
Subject: Re: The right to learn to the language.
In reply to: Graham Cox 's message, "The right to learn to the language." on 11:50:42 05/24/07 Thu

>>Your suggestion is ludicrous!!! people in this country
>>have the right to speak any language! The English who
>>go overseas dont learn foreign languages, and that is
>>ok because that is their right and freedom to speak
>>what language they like. They shouldnt expect ethnic
>>minorities to speak english though.
>----------------------------------------------------
>
>The English who "go" overseas... are you speaking of
>holidaymaking English people, or those who emigrate?
>If you are going to become inhabitant in any country,
>it is considered courteous, respectful and intelligent
>to learn the native tongue of the country you take
>residence in, and adapt to integrate into its society.
>
>Most emigrates DO learn the language, your family will
>be a good example of this; and many English ex-pats
>especially those who have left to set-up shop in
>Spain, Italy and the like make a special effort to
>speak the language. Using the excuse of "Me no speaker
>the Englisher" is pathetic, and THAT is why a lot of
>people are for the requirement of immigrants to learn
>the English language on arrival, regardless of their
>background. It has nothing to do with racism, more a
>way of defeating unscrupulous immigrants who speak
>English only when they have to, and decide not to when
>they assume it will get them what they want or get
>them out of a possible wrist-slap. E.g. off the hook
>for speeding. This is unacceptable and “rights” should
>not favour the perpetrator/s in these cases.
>
>----------------------------------------------------
> I am a British
>>Pakistani and i am a citizen of this Country but my
>>heritage is Pakistani and I cant help that, that is
>>who I am. I am proud of who I am and my culture and
>>proud to speak Urdu, which is a beutiful language.
>----------------------------------------------------
>
>I admire you for being proud to be a British
>Pakistani, although I must state that in multi-culti
>Britain, shouldn’t you drop the Pakistani bit in
>favour of diversity?
>
>If I now speak of my English pride, my pride in being
>white, my pride in the English language and my pride
>in my English heritage, how many do-gooders,
>offence-seekers and Galloway-worshipping morons will
>point their fingers, piss their beds and scream
>"RACIST!" at me?
>
>Can you, as a moderate and obviously level-headed
>person, explain why it is, that you can claim pride in
>your heritage, your background, religion, culture and
>your colour, yet I cannot, must not, and can face
>prosecution and persecution if I do? Then explain to
>me what fascism is.
>
>If you want to know why people like Kizzy exist, why
>racists exist and why parties such as the BNP are
>making ground, ponder my question for a moment. Most
>Muslims are not to blame, but there are those
>supposedly "representing" your religion and your
>culture that make integration impossible, and
>countless bed-wetting politically correct Liberal
>socialist idiots that will stifle debate and quash any
>questions regarding multiculturalism (multiracialism
>in drag), and the subsequent failed social experiment
>that has taken inter-racial harmony even further from
>reality.
>
>-------------------------------------------------------
>---
>
> The
>>point i am trying to make is You cant force people of
>>different cultures and language backgrounds to speak a
>>certain language! They will speak that language if
>>they wish, nd only if they wish.
>
>-------------------------------------------------------
>-
>
>And I repeat my comment stating when you settle in a
>country seeking asylum, residence, work, whatever, you
>SHOULD make an effort to speak the language. If you're
>there on holiday, then why bother agreed, but how many
>immigrants who make no effort to even adopt our
>culture or accept our laws, would attempt to learn our
>language, yet still expect the same handouts and
>treatment? That IS a genuine problem, and whatever
>morals you dictate, or whatever rights you uphold,
>they matter not in the face of common decency and
>sensibility. You can’t expect integration to happen if
>only one side of the racial divide is being forced to
>make an effort whilst Muslims are informed that they
>don’t even have to make an effort to communicate
>effectively if they wish not to.

First of all a large quantity of English people who go and live overseas do not bother to learn the local language from my experience. Their excuse is usually because English is an international language why bother learning it. To be honest I think they have a point and they have a right to do so and not be forced to learn a language if they dont wish to. Talking about unscrupulous immigrants and ethnic minorities, yes i agree with you they should be punished. But you cannot tar all people who do not want to speak english with the same brush, rather the law needs to be altered and a better one found to solve the problems you have mentioned above. I Certainly will never drop the PAKISTANI bit as you put it and i am frankly quite amazed that you would suggest that, like you said this is Multicultural Britain a Britain with many cultures Pakistanis being one of them! What you are suggesting is that we drop who we are and forget our heritage, a heritage that is one of the most rich in the world. We are first and foremost pakistani muslims, then british and there is nothing wrong with that and i dont think many of you english realise this. I dont believe at all that you are racist but just a little bit not informed.

And like you said quote"speak of my English pride, my pride in being
>white, my pride in the English language and my pride
>in my English heritage, how many do-gooders,
>offence-seekers and Galloway-worshipping morons will
>point their fingers, piss their beds and scream
>"RACIST!" at me?" you are probably right, but dont have ago at me about it. I think you are well within your rights to say all of what you have just said as long as you dont be racist to other cultures. I agree with you that the do gooders are a big problem and they cause most of the tension between my people and yours. It is they who we should get rid of. They should allow all people to celebrate their culture and heritage English, Pakistani etc.
As for spaeking a language, a person doesnt nedd to learn a whole language to learn the law. A person can be an abiding citizen without having to learn english. I know a few people who know the law very well but dont speak english, id argue that they know the law better than most English laymen. So I just think there is no need to make a big issue out of something like this. As long as we are all kind and polite to each other we dont have to have anything forced upon us. As for the muslims that cause problems well they are a minority troubled group just like in any society and we need to get rid of them. We have got our own societys here and we dont have to speak english in our society. Where I live is in an asian area and most people speak in the south asian languages, so there is no need to speak english and there are no problems if we dont.
Not being forced to learn a language is surely a liberty that everybody should have. For those who wish to learn another language good for them. By the way the BNP will never get into power.

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[ Contact Forum Admin ]

Forum timezone: GMT-8
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.