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Online Diploma -- Online Diploma (Education), 13:48:23 01/03/12 Tue [1]

There is little that can bedone for one that is two months old. That one ability havea askance tibia or a displaced Achilles bond. I am not able to advice either of those things on a two ages old bird.


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[> XXX--SPAM ALERT--XXX -- D C T - SPAM FIGHTER, 14:52:07 01/03/12 Tue [1]

THIS FORUM IS FOR POULTRY PROBLEMS
==================================


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splay leg silki -- marcie, 14:26:07 01/01/12 Sun [1]

hi, was wondering if you could show, post pic./send via email. how to fix a splay leg. i had one cornt. quail i tried to fix. after a month he passed. i have 1 batham 2mo with splay leg, he was doing really good till i took the bandaid off now he walks on the elbow. i have 1 silki babie with splay.and toes curled. please help. and i don't know what i'm doing wrong for this to happen. temp and humid. are good in the hatcher and incubator. please help. thank you so much
marcie


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[> Re: splay leg silki -- D C T friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:09:53 01/01/12 Sun [1]

First read my article at UPA website
www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/1/
You will find picture of hobble brace for straddle legs
and chick shoe for curled toes
============================
All my treatments are for VERY young poultry because with
each day the problems grow worse and the bones and joints
harden in the wrong position. There is little that can be
done for one that is two months old. That one might have
a twisted tibia or a displaced Achilles tendon (or even
both of these problems) I am not able to help either of
those things on a two month old bird.


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Possible broken or sprained foot? -- Anna, 14:14:21 12/06/11 Tue [1]

Hello,

Just found this site, and I'm hoping you can help me!

I'm a new chicken owner, and the other day one of our Rhode Island red hens had a heavy stone garden tile fall over onto her foot. Immediately after this happened I took a look at her foot-- no blood or visible cuts. She will not walk on the foot, and has been hopping around with the foot held limp up by her body. She will let me touch the foot gently, and as far as I can see it is not swollen or discolored.

I'm worried that the foot might be broken, and I don't want her to be in pain! I have read elsewhere that sometimes splinting the foot is a good idea to make sure it recovers in the correct shape. So far we've been keeping her in the coop (which she shares with two other chickens) with easy access to food and water. She has not been moving around too much, but aside from her foot she is still looking healthy, her eyes are bright and alert.

Do you have any recommendations for the situation? Should I try to splint her foot? Should I be supplementing her diet to help her recover?

Any advice you have would be much appreciated. Many thanks for your help!

Anna


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Replies:

[> Re: Possible broken or sprained foot? -- D C T friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:19:39 12/06/11 Tue [1]

Anna,
It may be a bruise. Perhaps pain is telling her to rest
while the foot heals.
Check the foot each day and see if all the toes can be put
in the position of a foot on the ground being used for
walking or standing. You do not want it to heal in a bent
position. If there really is a broken bone you can make a
"shoe" to tape on it. For an adult size hen you would use
coat hanger wire (steel) or better yet aluminum florist
wire about one eighth inch diameter. A picture of a
chick size shoe (same shape as adult shoe) can be found at
www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/1/
The shoe is taped to the bottom of the foot.
But remember--DO NOT USE SHOE UNLESS IT IS NEEDED.
Give raw green leafy vegetables finely chopped, hard boiled
eggs (chop eggs and pulverize the eggshell mixing it into
the egg for calcium) Chickens love beef...and they like it
raw. But they can eat it cooked, too.
If there is any change in that foot or any visible problem
you can make photograph of the foot and put it on a
website such as photobucket or villagephotos.com
and then post the link here.


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Chicken with a hurt leg -- Stephanie (:(), 14:12:09 11/28/11 Mon [2]

Hello I have a chick about 4months old and she has been hopping and not using one of her legs. She is still eating and hopping around. I have put food and water by her in the coop so she doesn't have to move too much but I was wondering if there was anything I could do for her. I looked at her leg and foot and it appears to be a little swollen but not sores on it that I can see. These are free range birds here on our farm so there is no telling what happened to her. Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thank you Stephanie


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[> Re: Chicken with a hurt leg -- D C T friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:25:40 11/28/11 Mon [1]

It is difficult to identify her problem. A photo or a video
would help. These can NOT be put on this forum but can be
put elsewhere and the link to them can be put here.


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[> [> Re: Chicken with a hurt leg -- Stephanie, 00:09:14 11/29/11 Tue [1]

Ok I will try and do that in the morning and see if I can get it uploaded. Thank you!


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balance and falling problems -- Lauree Strouse, 09:24:06 11/13/11 Sun [1]

Pet goose is falling down, blood tests were done nothing there. xrays were done there is more bone density on one leg. What does that mean and how do we stop Duck Duck from falling and hurting himself?


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[> Re: balance and falling problems -- D C T friendly poultry orthopdist, 19:37:55 11/13/11 Sun [1]

I wish that I knew the answer to your question but
Duck Duck's problem is new to me.
The only thing I can suggest is keeping him confined in
safe environment. I hope that you can find somebody that
has the answer or that he gets well on his own.


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Emergency PLEASE HELP -- Noel Eaton (SCARED), 11:38:12 11/12/11 Sat [1]

My chicken was attacked by a racoon this morning. I stopped the bleeding and stitched her up. She cannot straighten her left leg and get it under her to stand. Is there anything I can do? PLEASE HELP


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[> Re: Emergency PLEASE HELP -- D C T friendly poultry orthopdist, 12:13:34 11/12/11 Sat [1]

Noel,

You did not say where you live but if you are anyplace cold that hen needs to
move indoors with you while she tries to heal.
She needs either a body sling hung low enough for feet to touch floor
or
to be in a box with much soft material under her. Hay and straw are good but
have a way of getting kicked out of box all over your floor. Sponges are
better.
White sugar applied to wound will make it stop bleeding and the sugar kills germs
by pulling the moisture out of them.
Honey is good, too and has been used as a medication for centuries.

The leg needs rest with weight kept off of it.
Hard boiled eggs and chopped raw green leafy vegetable
will provide good nutrition


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Hens with a bum leg -- Melissa (Sad), 22:52:03 10/02/11 Sun [1]

I have a couple chickens around 20 weeks that are developing inward legs. They were completley healthy and are now limping and having issues. A couple have died which leads me to believe it is Meraks. I dont know how to help them or splint them to makes my hens more comfortable. I have about 30 hens answer fear this its spreading. I am seeing it in another hens that was fine a week ago. What to do???


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[> Re: Hens with a bum leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 11:01:43 10/03/11 Mon [1]

There is much good information about Marek's disease at:
http://www.shagbarkbantams.com/
---------------------
Just before Thanksgiving in 1999 I had a hen about six
months old that went down with one leg forward and one the
other direction. Was told that she probably had Marek's
and would die. I made her comfortable with a padded box
in my enclosed porch. But she was still alive when cold
weather came so I carried her box to hallway in house.
and, NO, she did NOT die from Marek's.......
after two and a half years she was beginning to get
control of her legs and seemed like she was going to
recover. But tragedy struck--she got tangled in a morning
glory vine in the fenced garden where she was spending
the day time hours on a warm day. The fire ants murdered
her. Fire ants are a species from South America that
invaded the southern United States of America. They kill
baby birds of ground nesting species and can harm humans,
especially babies and small children.
---------
Splints are not the answer to Marek's.
A padded box kept clean is good. A body sling is ok on
a short term basis, too. (two leg holes and a hole for
manure to fall through)


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Achilles tendon -- Kerri, 03:05:18 07/31/11 Sun [1]

How do I make a spling using a straw for my day old chick with a pulled achilles tendon?


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[> Re: Achilles tendon -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 07:13:03 07/31/11 Sun [1]

Can not think of any use for a straw when Achilles tendon
is displaced. If it has just popped out of place while the
chick was kicking off the eggshell or if it was stepped on
by a mother hen.....you can push it back into place with a
very gentle squeeze between your thumb and finger.
If it keeps popping out of place again (due to swelling or
inflamation) you will need to make a body sling or "chick
chair" to rest the joint and permit healing.


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3 Babies with Splayed legs -- Dawn (Help these babies!), 17:22:38 07/18/11 Mon [3]

Hi,
Hopeing you can help with 3 wild turkey babies rescued from the hay mower. Actually 6 rescued and 3 have leg issues, splayed out. I've put the hobble brace on each of them. One seems to be getting stronger and all looks well. The second one seems to be getting stronger as well however, when it's legs are "under" it one "pushes" right out the the side from the hip joint. the joint doesn't seem dislocated at this point but, something's not right. The 3rd one has a leg that's fine and a leg that sticks straight out the back on top of it being completely turned over out of joint. So, what would be the inside of the leg is actually on the out side and the leg then goes straight back. Is there some sort of "brace" or "splint" I can put on him to help keep it in place and give the poor little thing a chance? Any guidence is greatly appreciated!


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[> Re: 3 Babies with Splayed legs -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:29:07 07/18/11 Mon [1]

When there is a simple case of straddle legs the hobble
brace works very well but some of those turkeys may have
other injuries. Perhaps the Achillles tendon could be
dislocated. This tendon connects muscle on the back of
the tibia (drumstick) to the metatarsal bone crossing the
center of the hock joint (the line where chick fuzz ends
and bare scaly skin begins. Normally this tendon is in
a groove on rear of hock joint but can be displaced.
Can you photograph the injured legs, post photo at
villagephotos.com or photobucket then post the link to
the photos here? If you try to send photos to my email
address do not send large photo files or large number
of pictures in one email or my old computer can not
handle it. I will do my best to help your turkeys


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[> [> Re: 3 Babies with Splayed legs -- Dawn (Said), 09:25:53 07/19/11 Tue [1]

Oh My, do i feel bad this morning. Now the one whose leg seemed to be doing better and just had one leg going out to the side has both legs out behind him. what have i done to these poor babies...? Did i have the hobble on to close? I tried to keep it shoulder width apart. Anyway, here is the link to the pics please let me know if there is anything that can be done. http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2011-7/1368183/2159751

Thanks so much for the help!


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[> [> [> Re: 3 Babies with Splayed legs -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 00:01:05 07/20/11 Wed [1]

I had a hard time trying to view those photos with my
tired old computer but do have some suggestions.
Instead of having turkeys on shavings--try an old towel
which may give them better traction.
---
Try making a "chick chair" or a body sling.
Body sling is piece of cloth with two leg holes and a hole
placed for manure to fall through. This is supended
so that the bird's feet can touch the floor.
I am going to try to email you a picture of the
chick chair.


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Beaten up chick -- Roger, 06:45:54 07/15/11 Fri [3]

Hi,

We have a five week old chick that was doing great until we briefly showed her to our our adult hens (the chick is being reared indoors). One of the adults took a swipe at the chick with her foot and now the chick seems to have lost the use of her right leg.

It does not seem to be broken, or swollen and the chick can move her thigh but she seems unable to move her lower leg or her toes. When she is standing on one leg the bad one is held under her body with the foot dangling down (like a flamingo stance).

She is eating and hopping about but is clearly feeling a bit sad - what should we do?


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[> Re: Beaten up chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 09:40:54 07/15/11 Fri [1]

Roger,
The violence and cruelty of birds both wild and domestic
does make me sad.
Your options are: find a vet with poultry experience--
called "avien vet".
or make a body sling from an old tee shirt with corners
tied to cardboard box. To make this cut two leg holes and
another hole located correctly for manure to fall through.
for a chick as small as yours a kleenex box may be big
enough. After bird is in sling you may need to wrap it
to keep wings from flapping.
Or you may take photos of chick, post them on photo
storage website such as villagephotos.com or
photobucket and then post the link here.
Because it might help me see what is wrong with the leg.
It could be a tendon or joint injury or just a painful
bruise


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[> [> Re: Beaten up chick -- Roger, 18:33:49 07/15/11 Fri [1]

Hi,

Our local avian vet is a raptor specialist! In fact,a licensed falconer. She wasn't phased by our little chick though and diagnosed a broken leg above the foot (the bruising is now clear to see). She has put on a most professional splint/bandage and we are hopeful of a full recovery - many thanks!


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[> [> [> Re: Beaten up chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:04:29 07/15/11 Fri [1]

You are welcome. I exist to serve my Creator by helping
His most helpless creatures.
I am delighted to know that your chick has been treated by
a professional


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Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- Ruth, 19:37:38 06/06/11 Mon [12]

We have a male Bronze pet turkey with a swollen infected foot. It is just about the size of a baseball. The bottom of the foot is pus filled. I have applied Udder Balm but nothing else. There are no Avian vets in our area. Is there anything we can do to help him?

"Chase" is a year old and weighs 53 pounds. I know his weight is creating discomfort as he lays down most of the day and stumbles when he gets up.

Any help will be appreciated.

Thank you


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Replies:

[> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:57:14 06/06/11 Mon [1]

this seems to be a case of "bumble foot".
If the foot has a cavety full of infected fluid it must
be drained. If a solid mass of material has formed inside
the foot this must be removed. In either case once the
foot has been cleaned out the hole needs to be filled
with honey or a mixture of white sugar and water.
This will kill germs and promote healing


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[> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- Ruth, 11:21:22 06/07/11 Tue [1]

When I moved the flap on the bottom of the foot to clean out the area, it began bleeding a lot. There is also blood in the pus. The bone structure seems to be exposed in the pocket. Is there something else wrong with his foot and is there a special way to clean out the area to avoid the bleeding?

Once again, thank you for you help!


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[> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 12:35:26 06/07/11 Tue [1]

After you have washed the foot
PACK IT FULL OF WHITE SUGAR.
Then bandage that foot and keep him in a clean place.
Besides killing germs, sugar will stop the bleeding
----Please post a progress report here, too.


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[> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- Ruth, 17:15:02 06/07/11 Tue [1]

I washed the area and am not sure what to do. What I thought was a pus pocket is in between the toe and into what would be the flat area of the foot. There are three layers that are sandwiched together and each one is hard. When I lift the first layer that touches the floor, it has a hinge action but will bleed if pulled back too far. The second layer is rounded and will move stiffly. The third layer is not as round as the second layer but is firm. The first layer is leather like. The other layers are scaly and tough. +There is a milky area between one of the toes (I thought this was pus). Because of what I saw I was afraid to poke around on the foot. When I looked at the rest of the leg, I saw that there was a little swelling just before and around the hock area. Can you give me any instructions on how to proceed?

Thank you


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:34:46 06/07/11 Tue [1]

I would like to help but this is becoming WAY too
complicated for me to instruct you. You need to find
professional help. There is just no way for me to guess
what parts of that foot need to be kept or removed. Until
you can get help just pack it with the white sugar and
keep it wrapped with bandage tape.
Find out if your state has state poultry labs. They have
them here in Georgia because this state has large poulty
production industry. Or try internet search for the
nearest avian vet or even a wildlife rehab expert.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- Ruth, 22:34:55 06/16/11 Thu [1]

Since I last wrote I have not been able to find one avian vet or regular vet who will remove this bumblefoot for us. I have been cleaning and packing with white sugar everyday since your last correspondence to me. I have even asked for the help from neighbors who raise farm animals, where surgery is a daily occurrence for them. Sadly, most here feel he should be put on the dinner table. So, I have decided that if I do not proceed with removal of this we will lose Chase. Can you tell me all the area that is swollen, warm to touch and spongy should I just puncture that or do I completely remove all the skin. The swelling is happening between his toes also. Then on the bottom of the foot are two wafer like callous that are black and very hard. It's like it is dead skin that if I even cut it away, will not bleed. However, if I accidently pull one of them back too far it will begin to bleed. So I know at some point I will hit flesh that is very alive. Also, can he not feel when I cut him? Shouldn't I try and numb it somehow first? I have also been told it is highly contagious to my other birds as well as me; do you agree with that? Thank you so much for your patience and help!


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:45:28 06/17/11 Fri [1]

Ruth, You are welcome.
Will begin by saying that I have sincere doubts that there
is any danger of it being "highly contagious" to other
birds or people.
I do not know how long a 53 pound bird can live. Years ago
I had 35 pound bronze turkey who kept hitting my knees
as hard as he could until I sold him and his three female
companions.
You need to try seeking a vet on one of the popular forums
such as Back Yard Chickens where there are many people
that would have sympathy with your problem.
and check out shagbarkbantams.com
I do not want to try telling you what to cut and would
just keep packing with sugar and putting honey into
any deep crevaces. Ancient people used honey and even
wine on their injuries and sores. King Hezekiah was healed
of his deadly boil by a lump of figs


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:39:02 06/17/11 Fri [1]

Just a bit more infection fighting information from my
past.
There was a six month old green spalding peacock whose leg
had an injury at a weak spot. To make things even worse
the brace that I constructed for him caused an infected
sore in spite of all the padding that I put in it. I put
away that brace to never use it again and called a poultry
lab doctor about the infection that was threatening the
life of poor Lame Tiger. The state poultry lab doctor told
me to clean the sore twice a day before applying
Neosporin antibiotic ointment and then put DMSO on top
of that to drive the antibiotic into the skin.
That infection went away, the sore healed. The dead skin
pealed off of new skin and feathers covered the spot.
Lame Tiger lived to breed and produce offsprings.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- Ruth, 17:10:28 06/18/11 Sat [1]

This is an update on "Chase"...

We finally found a vet that would look at "Chase". I watched as he cut away many large pads from beneath the bumble foot sore. When he opened it up to bare meat more dead areas skin was exposed. He cut everything away and used a syringe of antibiotic fluid to flush out the three tubes in his leg. Each time he did a procedure, he explained what and why he did them. After he gave Chase shot, he put a pad that had been treated with an antibiotic salve under the cut area and bandaged it. When he was finished, he told me that Chase had a staph infection and I would have to do this everyday for a week to get rid of it and heal the foot. The hardest part of doing this is knowing that it does cause him pain. I would feel better if there were a way to ease his pain.

I will keep in touch about Chase's progress.

Thank you again! ! ! !


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:34:22 06/18/11 Sat [1]

You are welcome.
Thank you for the update. It is great that good medical
help was found. Chase is one fortunate turkey to have a
person like you to care for him in his distress.
Yes, please keep me updated.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- Ruth, 14:21:07 06/20/11 Mon [1]

We lost "Chase" during the night. I feel certain that it was due to shock and stress from all that was being done to him.
It looked as if he were trying to stand on his leg and in the process, knocked over the water and feeder units. His bedding indicated that he was struggled to get away. I wish there would have been a happier ending.

Thank you for all of your help. I know that taking in foundlings can give you happiness and sadness. We will concentrate on the happiness and continue trying to help the animals.

Ruth


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Turkey with a swollen infected foot -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:43:08 06/20/11 Mon [1]

Ruth,
I am sorry that Chase did not make it. It is likely that
toxins (blood poisoning) entered his blood and overwhelmed
him. The evidence of a struggle that you saw is what
happens when the heart is stopping while the bird tries
very hard to keep breathing.
Or here is another way to look at it.... as Murphy Peacock
was about to leave me I told him to "fly to Heaven"
and right after I said it he fluttered his wings and
left this painful old world.

You are very welcome to what little help I was able to
give. I exist to serve my Creator by helping His most
helpless creatures and will keep doing it for as long as
I am able.
Sometimes the creature I am helping wins and sometimes it
loses.
Thank you for giving me the "rest of the story" because
this helps me focus on what I am doing.


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silkie with hock problems -- Melinda (worried), 09:54:46 06/03/11 Fri [3]

hi I have a 1wk old silkie that is not walking well. The problem is that the hock is popped out of place I have put it back it to place and it keeps popping out and you can feel it when it's in place but as soon as I move my hand from the position of holding it in place it pops out. Right now am going to put him in a chair, his leg is swollen. What do I need to do to keep in place and is there any hope for my little chick.


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Replies:

[> Re: silkie with hock problems -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 00:38:55 06/04/11 Sat [1]

Being in a chick chair or a body sling will rest and
relieve pressure on the hock joint and perhaps this will
permit the swelling to subside so that the tendon will
stay in place.
----
This is often difficult to treat but MUST be done right now
before things get even worse


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[> [> Re: silkie with hock problems -- mshuey, 18:38:52 06/06/11 Mon [1]

my silkie is not doing well she is still eating and drinking but her hock joint is very swollen. Shes on pain meds asparin. Is there hope for my little chick or am i just causing her more pain by trying to save her. This leg is bent and she drags it. is there something elses going on?


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[> [> [> Re: silkie with hock problems -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:23:13 06/06/11 Mon [1]

The bad news is that treatment often fails.
If the bird is suffering and you wish to end the pain
the best way to end its life is to very suddenly remove
the head. Then very gently close the eyes and tell it
"good bye".
----
But if a bird is not in pain I may keep it for years.
I now have a peahen named Crazy Legs who is not in pain
but gets around in her own strange way on her bent legs.
I do not have a male with her because breeding could hurt
her. I think that she is satisfied with her life


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ORPHANED WILD TURKEYS JUST HATCHED AND ONE HAS FEET PROBLEMS -- TERI MILLER (WORRIED), 02:41:13 06/04/11 Sat [1]

I AM WORRIED ABOUT A DAY OLD WILD TURKEY WHO WE HAD TO HELP GET OUT OF HER EGG. SHE WAS THE FIRST TO PECK THROUGH, BUT THE LAST TO GET OUT AND WAS TOTALLY EXHAUSTED WHEN SHE FINALLY MADE IT BUT NOW IS HAVING TROUBLE WALKING. SHE IS ALSO MUCH SMALLER THAN THE OTHER TWO AND HER TOES ARE TURNED IN. SHE WAS BEING RUN OVER BY HER SIBLINGS AND HER BREATHING SEEMED TO BECOME MORE LABORED SO WE PUT HER IN HER OWN BOX WITH A SMALL STUFFED, VERY SOFT TEDDY BEAR AND SHE'S MUCH CALMER AND SLEEPS WITH HER HEAD ACROSS HIS ARM. SHE IS JUST ONE DAY OLD SO I WILL TRY THE CHICK SHOE I JUST DON'T WANT TO HURT HER SO ANY PRECAUTIONS I SHOULD TAKE WOULD BE APPRECIATED. THANKS


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Replies:

[> Re: ORPHANED WILD TURKEYS JUST HATCHED AND ONE HAS FEET PROBLEMS -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:03:39 06/04/11 Sat [1]

Teri,
You have started very well. Newly hatched poultry need
brooder temperature of about 95 degrees (f).
The chick starter (turkey or gamebird starter) should be
medicated with Amprolium to prevent coccidiosis. Most
feed stores sell medicated chick starter but check the
label.
Sometimes a small mirror will make a lonely chick think
that it has a companion and helps it identify with its
own species.
A feed suppliment such as Vionate would supply calcium
to strengthen those toes as you straghten them with the
"shoes"


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2 front spraddle legs -- kim (worried), 21:21:26 06/03/11 Fri [1]

My one day old peachick has both legs splayed in front so she is sitting on her butt leaning forward. She is being brooded by a little silkie hen with 2 brothers/sisters who are fine. They are not picking on the nonwalker yet. Please help. Thanks


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Replies:

[> Re: 2 front spraddle legs -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 00:47:44 06/04/11 Sat [1]

Please read my article at UPA website.

www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/1/
and if you have any more questions just ask.
The "hobble brace" in my article should help---
but, please note: you will need to move the peachick to
a brooder while treating the problem or it will be
trampled


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Chicken with growth issues now has curled toes -- Chris Brown, 01:32:28 06/01/11 Wed [3]

I have a 9 week old chick who is about the size of a 3 week chick. She is still covered in fluff and her few feathers are growing in abnormal patterns. Alas, she clearly has genetic issues. OK, to the point:
She had what I thought was a broken toe, but now the other toes on one leg are curling in. She is on medicated chick feed, though only for two weeks. She was on organic before that. She stumbles due to her unbalanced/uneven feet. I have many pictures.
What should I do for her?


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Replies:

[> Re: Chicken with growth issues now has curled toes -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 09:23:40 06/01/11 Wed [1]

You can add chopped hard boiled eggs and some finely
chopped raw green leafy vegetables to the other food the
chick is eating. Take the eggshell and pulverize it to a
powder and mix it with the boiled egg as a calcium source.
Also take cod liver oil and vitamin D capsules, pierce the
capsules and squeeze them onto feed that the chick eats.
-------
You can put your photos of this chick on a photo storage
website such as villagephotos.com or photobucket and then
post the link to them here.
------
Read my article at UPA website:
www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/1/


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[> Re: Chicken with growth issues now has curled toes -- Christa Brown, 11:19:59 06/01/11 Wed [1]

Here is the link about Nan:

http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=492333

I've been doing the hard boiled egg, but I will try everything else you suggested, thanks!


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[> [> Re: Chicken with growth issues now has curled toes -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:04:21 06/01/11 Wed [1]

You are welcome

Was NOT able to see Nan's feet.
Did you read my article?


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week old baby chick possible dislocated hip? -- Becky, 14:19:22 05/30/11 Mon [3]

I am looking after a week old baby chick that has started having trouble with his left leg. He keeps it straight out to the side whilst trying to walk! I can bend the leg into the correct position which doesnt seem to cause any pain for the little chap. Just wandering if you can help in any way? I have to take him back to work tomorrow where the decision could be out of my hands! I would really like to help him if possible before the decision to have him put down is made!


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[> Re: week old baby chick possible dislocated hip? -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:31:27 05/30/11 Mon [1]

this seems like "straddle legs" caused by one or both hip
joints being out of place due to injury or week muscles.
Treatment is the "hobble brace"---a piece of tape
connecting legs at shoulder width (the chick's shoulders)
with tape at ankle level. To see picture of hobble brace
check my article on UPA website

www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/1/


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[> [> Re: week old baby chick possible dislocated hip? -- Becky, 12:17:53 05/31/11 Tue [1]

Thank you for you advice! I looked this up and have applied the hobble today. Hopefully this will help! Thanx again.
Bex


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[> [> [> Re: week old baby chick possible dislocated hip? -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:05:14 05/31/11 Tue [1]

Bex,
You are welcome. I exist To serve my Creator by helping
His most helpless creatures.
Please tell me how the treatment works on your chick.
D C T, friendly poultry orthopedist


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Guinea Keet - Slipped Tendon -- Tim Quinn, 14:54:34 05/29/11 Sun [1]

Hello,

We have one keet, about two weeks old, that has a slipped Achilles tendon. She's been having trouble walking for at least a week, but we were not treating it correctly, because we thought that it was some sort of infection. We didn't find out what the problem really was until yesterday when we found posts/pics describing the problem. She still walks, gets around and feeds OK, even successfully perching, but always holds her leg up, putting no real amount of weight on it. Her joint is very swollen, enough so that we cannot move the tendon far enough to get it to the back of the leg.
Is there any way to reduce the swelling? Since she is walking OK, we don't like the idea of confining her to a chick chair, but if that's called for, we'll make one. Any ideas, or what other info would you like? Thank you very much. Tim


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Replies:

[> Re: Guinea Keet - Slipped Tendon -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:18:44 05/29/11 Sun [1]

Ouch!
That leg MUST have rest and be prevented from doing itself
more injury. A displaced Achilles tendon soon brings
inflamation to the joint. Usually the skin becomes torn
so that infection causes even more swelling. Antibiotic
ointment should be applied. A bit of cortizone (prednisone)
might help reduce swelling, too.
Working with a guinea is not easy. They tend to be wild
and will suffer from stress when handled. I do remember a
tame one that had bonded with my mother but Mother and
her pet are long gone.
Try the "chick chair" and give me a progress report


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Turkey Leg -- Bill Carvill (worried), 21:57:09 05/24/11 Tue [7]

I have a 4 to 5 week old bronze turkey that I bought when it was about a week old from a farm supply store. All was good till about a week or so ago. I noticed both middle toes are turning outward and his right leg is turning outward. I have done a lot of research on it and it seem like it could be straddle leg and crooked toe. Some posts say diet/ nutrition, he is on a 20% crumbled. I am going tomorrow to get a higher protein feed and try the straddle bandage method and splint his middle toe. I am new to chicken and turkey raising. I had a small bantam chick with the issue the first week I got the 6 chicks and I did the straddle technique and all work out in about 4 days. Does this sound correct in what I am wanting to do. He is a cool turkey. He calls for me and likes to follow me around the yard when I am working outside. I don't want to make it worse or hurt him. Thank you for any help you arte able to give. Bill


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Replies:

[> Re: Turkey Leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:39:59 05/24/11 Tue [1]

Years ago I had a male bronze turkey that weighted 35
pounds. His hen turkeys weighed 14 pounds.
A baby turkey is about the same size as a baby India blue
peacock--but the baby turkey really goes into over drive at
growing. This fast growth is really hard on the tender
bones and joints.
I have not had opportunity to scientifically prove this
but I suspect that slowing the growth would be better for
the legs. But I do know that the breeds of chicken that
grow fast are more likely to have leg problems.
---
I used to give my peachicks the high protein starters--
that is until I found out they had fewer leg problems when
fed common medicated chick starter.
---
I suspect that your turkey is now too old and big for
toe straightening. The leg that has turned outward
is most likely to have a twisted tibia (main bone
found in "drum stick"). Or it could be the Achilles
tendon slipped out of place. You can tell if the tendon
is displaced by comparing it with the other leg. If
joints are the same then is is NOT a slipped tendon.
My attempts to treat turkey legs have been failures
I am sorry to say.


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[> [> Re: Turkey Leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:47:54 05/24/11 Tue [1]

If you still want to try treating that turkey's leg there
are some things that sometimes work on young peafowls.
If you are interested in trying reply to this post.


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[> [> [> Re: Turkey Leg -- Bill C, 07:08:05 05/25/11 Wed [1]

I would appreciate any info you have.I just do not want him to suffer or hurt. I have check for brakes, none..... infection,none...... slipped tendon, does not seem to.I rolled it between my finger with a slight pinching and nothing moved..... visually compared the leg and they look the same other than it wants to lay to the side at about a 30 degree angle further outward. He walks on it but looks a little funny because he waddles, kind of like a women in her 3rd trimester. He flaps his wings if he wants to run. He is alone in a wood chips layered container about 6 to 8 times bigger than he is. He spends time loose outside with me when working on the pens for the chickens. I also put him withe the chicks he has grown up they like to run around and look for each other. I just don't keep them together for the fear of blackhead disease(as I have read about). Thanks


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[> [> Re: Turkey Leg -- Bill C, 06:52:03 05/25/11 Wed [1]

Thank You for your insight. I am changing his diet to higher game bird diet and going to also try a 12 on 12 off diet that i have seen posted on other sights. Thanks again


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[> [> [> Re: Turkey Leg--(TREATMENT) -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 09:25:11 05/25/11 Wed [1]

Calcium and other minerals for bone strength would be good.
A twisted tibia will NEVER get better without treatment
but even with treatment there is no guarantee of success.
The first time I ever had a complete cure for a twisted
tibia was on a peachick that I named Firestone for a tire
company that was producing a defective tire that year.
Firestone is now a mature green spalding peahen with no
evidence of her bad beginning. In the first two weeks of
her life she had some orthopedic problems of the very
ordinary kind that I cure without even bothering to take
notes. Then at two weeks of age one of her legs went to
the side with a twisted tibia. That got my attention
so that I tried a new thing. Each night I wrapped one of
her legs in sponge and then taped both legs firmly
together so that the muscle action of her struggle to
pull loose would put pressure on the twisted bone to
straighten it. But each morning I removed all tape and
sponge so that she could walk around all day eating and
living normal life. I did this for only five nights and
then no longer needed to do it because her cure was
complete.
Then I used the treatment on other pea chicks and even
did a modified treatment on a bantam cockerel. His
treatment took a whole month because of the hardness
of his bones. But he came out of treatment with both legs
working. He uses them to attack his keeper (me).
If you use the night time taping REMOVE WATER CONTAINER.
A bird with taped legs can drown.


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[> [> [> [> Re: Turkey Leg--(TREATMENT) -- Bill C, 13:18:31 05/25/11 Wed [1]

Thank you for the info. I have seen some other posts with the same method. I will start it tonight. i will let you know what happens in a few days. Thank You


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[> [> [> [> Re: Turkey Leg--(TREATMENT) -- Bill C, 22:29:31 05/25/11 Wed [1]

just an update: I taped his toes with equestrian tape and a small splint to help straighten them. I found that the hock joint was popped out. I popped the joint back in and taped it to immobilize it. once the joint was lined up his leg rolled easily to a straight position but did not want to stay on its own.It popped back very easy. I also check to see if the tendon rolled. It did not feel any different than the good leg. I then proceeded with the process you suggested of wrapping the leg and taping it to the other. I used equestrian tape so it would not stick to him or the bedding. I did have to wrap him gently and loosely in a shirt to keep him comfortable and stop flapping


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2 week old Buckeye chick with backward leg -- Patty, 13:05:31 05/20/11 Fri [3]

Hi, I have a 2 week old Buckeye chick that I had to help hatch. Last week I realized that the leg was now twisted backward. No swelling or redness and the chick does put weight on it when I hold it. It just looks like it is doing the splits. What is worse is the other chicks keep stepping on the leg because it sits so far out from the chick. Help! I tried the bandaid splint thinking it was splay legs. Did it the first time for 3 days with no change.


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Replies:

[> Re: 2 week old Buckeye chick with backward leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 16:11:27 05/20/11 Fri [1]

If this is not straddle legs (probably not or the hobble
brace would have cured it) and since the chick is using the
leg it is probably not a displaced Achilles tendon....
So the only other likely thing would be a twisted tibia.
The tibia is the main bone in the part of leg that is
called a "drum stick"
========
Treatment for twisted tibia on young chick is:
THE NIGHT TIME TAPING.
One leg is wrapped in thin layer of carpet padding or
other sponge material. Then both legs are taped together
touching eacheother. That padding is to prevent bruising
of leg jounts and it does not really matter which leg
it is on.
REMOVE WATER TO PREVENT DROWNING OF BOUND CHICK.
This is done for five nights--with tape removed each
morning. If the chick is with others in a brooder that
has a light--it will need to be protected from other
chicks during trreatment.


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[> Re: 2 week old Buckeye chick with backward leg -- Patty, 19:46:23 05/20/11 Fri [1]

thanks so much for your response. I have a question. Do I force the leg back around to the appropriate position as I tape it? Does this hurt the bird?


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[> [> Re: 2 week old Buckeye chick with backward leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:27:22 05/20/11 Fri [1]

You are welcome.

A young chick should be soft and pliable...
but if it is not and the treatment causes pain you should
stop. The purpose of this treatment is for the action of
the muscles pulling against the tape to untwist the
tibia. The first time I used this method I had a two week
old green spalding peachick that had started with some
other orthopedic problems which I had treated and cured.
Then her tibia twisted and I tried the treatment as an
experiment since there was nothing to lose. After five
nights of treatment she was completely cured and the
problem did not return. I named her Firestone for the
tire that was having defects that year. She is now
several years old with no evidence of orthopedic problems.
I have treated other chicks since then helping most of
them. But after one drowned in water I have remembered to
remove water during treatment.


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silkie chick with swollen feet -- nicole, 09:19:06 05/15/11 Sun [1]

I have a one week old chick that has very swollen feet and lower legs. What is this and how can I fix it. It is still moving around and eating but can not stand at all. HELP


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[> Re: silkie chick with swollen feet -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:57:13 05/15/11 Sun [1]

This is a very unusual problem and I can not think of a
treatment I am sorry to say. Try to find a vet as soon as
possible. And if there is a treatment please tell me about
it so that I can share it with others


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Possible Leg Deformity -- Andrea (sad), 23:48:14 04/10/11 Sun [1]

I have a day old chick that appears to be unable to extend it's legs. It sits on it's keel, with head extended. Feet/lower legs are turned out. I tried a spraddle hobble made from a band aid, but I am not convinced that it will help. Any suggestions?


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Replies:

[> Re: Possible Leg Deformity -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 08:54:01 04/11/11 Mon [1]

When a newly hatched chick does not have the power to move
the lower leg it is very likely that the Achilles tendon is
displaced. This may be happen as the chick kicks off the
eggshell or if it is stepped on by hen. The Achilles tendon
passes the rear of hock joint (where fuzz ends and scaly
shin begins). There is a groove in center of joint where
this very important tendon should be.
If this injury is found right after it happens a gentle
squeeze between your thumb and finger can put the tendon
back on center so that it will remain there. But if there
has been time for the chick to struggle inflamation can
cause swelling that actually blocks the tendon from
staying in place. And as time goes by the irritation grows
worse and the skin will be torn letting in germs to
start an infection.
This problem can occur on one or both legs. The use of
"hobble brace" seldom does any good.
If the tendon refuses to stay in place when pushed there
by thumb and finger the chick needs to rest in a "chick
chair" while inflamation subsides.


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How to remove spurs on rooster -- Ruth, 19:06:12 04/06/11 Wed [1]

We have a rooster that is flogging us. Can the spurs be removed by using the hot potato method or must they be cut?

Thank you for your assistance.


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[> Re: How to remove spurs on rooster -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:16:52 04/06/11 Wed [1]

OK, there are two problems here
One. Bad behavior of rooster
Two. How to remove spurs.
If he is like a certain bantam that was brought here as a
chick for life changing repairs and has reminded me that
"No good deed goes unpunished"....having dull spurs will
not change his bad behavior.
But I NEVER use a hot potato on him but use my most humane
spur trimming method on him then carry a stick or fish net
when in his pen.
I have a very gentle red rooster whose spurs turn up and
could injure his vent. I bought one of those
Pedi-Paws (tm) for trimming claws on cats and dogs.
To trim a spur the plastic guard must be removed from
over the sand paper covered wheel. It took a while to
grind down his spurs leaving over an inch of spur with
round tip. There is a core in the spur that is full of
blood vessels and nerves which I am VERY careful to
NOT cut into.
In past I had used wire cutters or horse shoe nail nipper
to cut off the tip of spur and then file it but the
Pedi-Paw method is safer and much more gentle.
My big red rooster was able to sit still on my lap and
behave very well (I live alone so there was nobody to
hold him) but a wild chicken can be controlled by
putting a sock over his head and/or taping his legs.
******************
And if you have a potatoe do NOT use it on the rooster
spurs--just add salt and butter before eating it.


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Paralysed Chicken -- alicia, 14:45:02 04/02/11 Sat [3]

Dear Chicken Lovers,
My 3 yr old chicken, normally very healthy although no longer laying has suddenly lost the use of her legs, I can find no damage but the night before the loss of use I left her outside in the garden with her sister slightly longer than usual and I went to lock them up I found she was outside her coup snuggled down which was a first. I picked her up and put her to bed but the next morning she could barely walk although as the day progressed she appeared to improve and was walking. The following day however, she could not walk at all and has not since. It is now 10days. Until yesterday I was feeding her with a syringe small amounts of yoghurt with great difficulty and I thought she was going to die, but yesterday I made some porridge and she managed to feed herself, she has a strong will to live but she just cannot walk. I have today made a sort criss cross perch out out of an old sheet threaded through the side of plastic crate and have threaded legs through and so her body is resting on the sheet strips. I read posts about making sling with a t shirt but cant quite figure out how. Does anyone have photo of one or any ideas if she will regain the use of her legs.


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[> Re: Paralysed Chicken -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:27:05 04/02/11 Sat [1]

The most common reasons for loss of use of legs are
Marek's disease and botulism. With loving care some birds
do recover. Vitamins of all kinds, chopped raw green leafy
vegetables such as cabbage, kale, brocalli or romaine
lettuce are good, too, as well as chopped hard boiled eggs.
A small amount of Prednisone (cortizone) will help with
healing inflamed nerves which may be causing paralysis.
I do not have photo of sling but photo of chick chair does
exist. Will try emailing that to you.


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[> [> Re: Paralysed Chicken -- Alicia, 03:41:24 04/03/11 Sun [1]

Thank you for your response it is comforting to know there is someone out there who is not laughing at my predicament. I feel it can't be Marek's because of her age (3yrs plus how could she catch it in my backyard?). However, she did suffer some sort of trauma the night before the paralysis as she flew/scrabbled over the fence separating my patio from my lawn (a thing she does many times a day - but she is never able to fly back again and I always have to open the gate to get her to the lawn side). I did not realise this until quite late and it was dark (7pm). She had not managed (as usual) to fly back over and put herself to bed, so just snuggled down outside her coop as close as possible to her sister (on the inside). I have cats who have lived with her all her life but she could have ingested cat poo from the garden (1) I have rats and have put 'organic lovely rat poison' down their various holes and covered them up - did she accidently eat some poison (2), did she damage herself trying to fly home (3), a week or so before this her comb had been getting redder and redder and more prominant, whilst her sisters is withering away to a grey/red nothing - does she have high blood pressure and therefore suffered some sort of stroke? (4).
What I need to know in your experience is do you think she will ever walk again if she has botulism from the poo/poison does it mean permanent damage? Or if it is a stroke might she recover the use of her legs and why only her legs why not her wings?
Any answers gratefully received. Thank you


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[> [> [> Re: Paralysed Chicken -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 15:37:44 04/03/11 Sun [1]

I NEVER laugh when a bird is suffering.
Marek's disease can occur in adult chickens even more often
than botulism which more often hits juveniles so that I
refer to it as juvenile paralysis.
botulism can inlude neck twisting spasms (or not)
I can not be certain that this is Marek's the treatments
that I suggest are good for whatever this is.
Often the wings still work when legs do not.
I do not use rat poison because I do not want a poisoned
mouse to stagger out and be eaten by a chicken, peafowl
or one of the cats that I keep for rodent control.
Chicken combs lose color during molting and get red again
when the hen begins laying again after getting new
feathers.
hmmm....have never heard of high blood pressure in
chickens but in fiercely hot weather there might be a
heat stroke but this is likely to kill a bird on the spot.
------
MORE THAN ONE CHICKEN HAS RECOVERED AND WALKED AGAIN.
some do not make it but it is good to try helping them
and make their last days comfortable


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Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie, 18:48:16 07/28/10 Wed [61]

Charlie is a 6wk 0ld peachick Walking find next day the left leg was turning out. I try the tape on legs not working, It has been aweek Charlie is not walking flapping is wings trying to walk left leg is out on his side, He is eating and drinking. Help Could it be a twisted tibia.Georgina


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Replies:

[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie, 21:24:16 07/28/10 Wed [1]

I took Charlie to vet on the Wednesday he took ex rays nothing was broken, When he was holding him the right leg was fine but left leg was turning out. He said he needed orthopedic surgery. Which would cost $2500. Charlie Is crawling with one leg forward and left leg to side and flapping his wings. I really hate to put him down Georgina


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:05:22 07/28/10 Wed [1]

Georgina, It nust be a twisted tibia because if there had
been any damage to the hock joint the vet should have
noticed it. A peachick that age may or may not get some
benefit from the sponge brace method.
You cut this from a piece of old sofa cushion.
This is carved with groove on each side the shape of the
leg (above and below hock joint) Then this is taped
between the legs.


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie, 08:08:10 07/29/10 Thu [1]

How Long Should I keep this on and does he need leg hobbles to?Georgina


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie, 08:12:28 07/29/10 Thu [1]

How Long Should I keep this on and does he need leg hobbles to?Do you have a picture. Georgina


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 08:58:38 07/29/10 Thu [1]

If you do not get any results in four weeks of treatment
it is time to stop. I have a peahen several years old that
I treated as peachick and failed to cure. She is able to
walk in a strange way and perch on a tire but I do not keep
a male with her because she is too fragile for mating.
----I have a diagram sketch of the sponge brace and may be
able to find photo for you. You can get my email address by
clicking "contact forum administrator". Be sure to put
"POULTRY" in subject line of your email to avoid being
lost in the spam. ------There is another peahen, treated
at age two weeks that was completely cured with no evidence
that she ever had twisted tibia


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 12:18:35 07/29/10 Thu [1]

I found a picture How far past hock should the foam go up . I put some on him his leg is still out to the one side I put tape on the bottom of legs. his leg his still out on it side not as bad. Do I have these thing on right? The foam is 2 inches past hock put not to the top of leg? How far sould the holes be apart in foam? Georgina


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 19:15:04 07/29/10 Thu [1]

Hi he is doing a bit better, The one leg is still out on his side. He tips him self over when he moves to fast.Am I Doing The treatment right. Georgina


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie, 22:10:10 07/29/10 Thu [1]

Hi I not sure I done this right by reading your method with the foam, I have email you for apicture or diagram Georgina


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:17:56 07/29/10 Thu [1]

Can NOT find any email from you, my email address is:
townsend@pineland.net
...and if you found a picture of sponge brace anywhere--
PLEASE TELL ME WHERE.


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[> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 07:26:08 07/30/10 Fri [1]

I found a picture of a foam brace on larsencreek.com on chicken and leg problems by mistake I not sure it is what you are taking about, Georgina


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[> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 09:59:18 07/30/10 Fri [1]

Georgina, I still have NO email from you.
Can you make photo of your peachick's leg, post it on a
website like photobucket or villagephotos.com, and then
put the link to it here?


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 17:29:32 07/31/10 Sat [1]

We Email You photoes of Charlie legs. Please let me no if you receive them. Geogina


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 19:57:39 07/31/10 Sat [1]

Got photos and replied by email.
As stated in my email this seems to be injury to stifle
joint--which is like human knee


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 08:23:17 08/01/10 Sun [1]

Please email again Did not receive it yet about charlie knee. Georgina


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 08:54:10 08/01/10 Sun [1]

OK, went to my "sent items" file and sent it again.
Pineland has just moved its internet location this weekend
so that may have been the problem. I certainly AM concerned
about email getting lost.


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 09:59:17 08/01/10 Sun [1]

No email yet. Georgina


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 10:07:14 08/01/10 Sun [1]

Hello again
No email yet so it must be the connection. I will watch for it and let you know. In the meantime what do you recommend?
Thanks


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:47:45 08/01/10 Sun [1]

I HAVE COPIED AND PASTED MY EMAIL BELOW PLEASE REPLY HERE
SINCE PINELAND MUST STILL BE HAVING PROBLEM
-------------------------------------------------

Dear Candice and Georgina,

Good photos.
The problem appears to be in the stifle joint which is the one that compares to the human knee joint.
The hock joint and Achilles tendon are NOT the problem. Hock is joint on line between feathers and
scale covered shin and frequently is the focal point of problems---but not Charlie's.
A chicken or peafowl stifle joint does have some stuctures simular to the human knee.
There may be some injury to this joint or some twisting of tibia. Am not certain if hip joint is involved
in Charlie's problem

It might help to rest Charlie at night in a body sling. A sling can be made of old tee shirt. Cut two leg holes
and another hole placed for manure to fall through and attach corners to a cardboard box or old chair frame
with seat gone...keeping this safe indoors where you can watch him.
If this is a joint injury resting may let it heal.

Please stay in contact with me so that I can help you if anything changes

Sincerely

D C T
friendly poultry orthopedist


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[> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 10:05:20 08/02/10 Mon [1]

So the sling seemed to help, he seemed comfortable last night. He cant walk out of the sling so I was thinking of keeping him in the sling during the day as well and taking him out to exercise him every couple of hours. He just flapps around and I think he injures it more.

I was also going to try to splint the leg while he is in the sling to put it back into its normal position that way it heals back to a normal position. Would that be ok?

How long does something like this take to heal and how long should i keep him in the sling, 2-4 weeks?

Thanks!


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[> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- charlie, 11:44:32 08/03/10 Tue [1]

First day of sling kept flipping him self out So I had to sew a piece of material over him to keep him from falling out He seems content and not crying so much when he is trying to stand up on his own, I also add egg yolk and yogart to is diet once aday, We Did not put a splint on his leg. He has gone threw a lot of stress. Is there any thing else we should be doing? Also how long should I keep him in Sling? Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 18:44:11 08/03/10 Tue [1]

I think that you are doing good work and should keep
Charlie in sling most of time. If this is an injury to the
stifle joint perhaps it will heal. Am not certain about the
usefulness of of bracing leg. You are in a better position
to see if that would help. After a month of treatment you
will be certain if the sling did any good.


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[> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 18:47:25 08/07/10 Sat [1]

Hi Charlie Is been in the sling aweek now . He is eating and drinking with no problem. His feet are touching bottom of box. The Left leg is still turning out. He try to stand when I come into see him, Left leg His Still a problem. Should His feet be touching the bottom? Is their anything else I should be doing Georgina


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 20:47:13 08/07/10 Sat [1]

YES, feet should be able to rest flat on surface below the
sling or chair in ALL treatment scenarios. This is to make
the bird comfortable and prevent excessive struggling.
For Charlie's leg treatment--get a new ordinary kitchen
sponge about an inch thick, cut a piece to wrap around a
leg covering the hock joint, too. Tape this on either leg
since its purpose is to prevent hock joints from rubbing.
Then go below and tape both shins together--with that inch
of sponge between them. This may (or may not) help that
left leg.


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[> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Up date, 19:44:11 08/13/10 Fri [1]

Charlie has been really restless the last two days using the sling as a swing, So to day I took him out for a while, No Change he try to walk a little but left leg has not improve any The good leg is not as strong, I put him back in the sling,It has been two weeks,He has grown in length.I havenT but the sponge on yet My daughter is coming home this weekend. Could his hip be out? Do you need more pictures,Geprgina


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[> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:08:30 08/13/10 Fri [1]

Due to the suddeness of the original problem I suspect it
to be injury to stifle joint. I could see in the pictures
that you sent that the hock joint seemed OK. But there
could be twisting of tibia. But the treatment I gave was
the right one. The alternate treatment would be night time
taping with days free. Legs are padded with sponge to
prevent bruising and the shins taped firmly together.
REMOVE WATER WHILE LEGS ARE TAPED TO PREVENT DROWNING.
Remove tape in daytime.
Yes, try sending me some more pictures


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[> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 07:31:45 08/14/10 Sat [1]

Charlie is in a sling all day Should I tape his legs in the sling. Or take him out at night and tape them? I will Email you Pictures today, Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 08:26:39 08/14/10 Sat [1]

I will wait until I see pictures and then decide what to
suggest. And due to past email problems I will put my reply
here on this forum. I hope to be back online tonight.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 20:08:41 08/14/10 Sat [1]

OK, photos came and I looked at them carefully.
Here is treatment schedule:
For 23 hours a day keep Charlie in sling with legs taped
and padded. Wrap sponge around and between lower legs and
hock joints with lower legs taped firmly together.
Remove tape and sponge and let him out of sling for a
half hour each morning and evening for exercise and so that
you can observe progress. Treatment will take at least a
month but I want a weekly report.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 08:10:39 08/17/10 Tue [1]

Charlie is not taking this taping and on taping very well .He seem To be really trying hard to walk when I let him out for his exercise,He evan stood up on his bad leg couple time ( It is still turn to side)Only problem I am Having When I try turn that leg and tape it Charlie Goes nuts. So Last Night I put him back in is sling left him alone. There still seem to be pain in that stife joint it is a lot better. Should I wait a another week and try again? With foam and taping.Also I have been taping from above his hocks down to above feet is this right, Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 08:20:18 08/17/10 Tue [1]

Do you want the sponge below the hocks on legs and then tape together below the hocks? Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 11:25:57 08/17/10 Tue [1]

The hock joints are what I especially want to protect from
bruising. Put plenty of sponge between them.
It is important to bring the legs below hock joint very
close together from hocks down to the feet while he is in
the sling.
Try to get bandage tape that is easy to remove--the kind
that is for sensative skin.
It is good that he will try walking during his exercise
time.
It is best to get the repair done now because the older a
bird is the harder and more set the bones become. Another
thing I learned in my years of trial and error--If I ever
failed to completely put the legs in perfect working order
there was a large chance that everything would bend
badly after treatment stopped. My peahen Crazy Legs is the
exception to this. The sponge brace treatment I did on her
was only partly successful but she has kept her ability to
walk in her strange way even now as she is several years
old. I hope that Charlie can be repaired completely but
if not I hope that he can remain able to stand up and
walk. The goal of "poultry orthopedics" is to get the best
quality of life for the bird


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 18:32:07 08/22/10 Sun [1]

Charlie has improve a little bit every day this week. He is walking with both legs. His left leg is getting stronger it is still turn.When he first starts is walking he not to bad, about 15minutes as he gets tried is leg start to turn. We still go a little crazy when we have to go back in sling and foam and taping of legs. Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:11:40 08/22/10 Sun [1]

Georgina, I am glad that there is progress. It is best to
persist with the treatments until leg is perfect.
Please keep sending a report each week (or sooner if you
have a problem).


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 07:41:22 08/30/10 Mon [1]

Hi Charlie is improving alittle bit each day. This must be a slow process.He is walking alot better but,gets tired quickly. Then his leg starts turning out to side, He really good first 10 min.I wrap his legs with strips of wool. The sponge would not stay in place ,with all the jobing around, Iam still having problem with gettig the left leg straight when wrapping and taping. Some days he his good about it and other days I have more tape on me.Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:30:32 08/30/10 Mon [1]

Georgina, Thank you for the update on Charlie. It is good
to know that progress is being made. You need to keep on
treating him, hoping for complete cure. After all peafowl
can live a long time. I have a 21 year old black shoulder
peacock and a 23 year old India blue. I have read of them
living past 30 years. My poor Murphy lived only seven
years because when he was a peachick I did not have the
the experience that I have now so his treatment failed.
But Firestone, my first success with treatment of twisted
tibia, is doing well. She was younger than Charlie when
her treatment began so her treatment took less time.
The younger a bird is when treatment begins the sooner it
can be cured. There is nothing that I can do with an adult
except splint a broken leg or bind a broken wing.
Please keep those updates coming


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 13:30:12 09/03/10 Fri [1]

Hi I built a stand for Charlie sling so I can take him out doors during the day I finally got him to hang in it with out slipping out and hanging upsidedown with his feet tape. What a week the last three days have been very hot. So I let him out for a hour he walks around, groom himself,sit down when he starts to get tired.I also have a younger peacock with him which he loves. So then we go back in sling which is be coming a real fight Trying to tape his legs is nearly impossible. I let him out 3 times a day.His left leg is still turnig when he his tired.I am by myself trying to tape him up. My husband at work. Could he be getting muscle cramping? or should I be doing something different, Charlie is better at nighttime I am getting frustrate, Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie,Update, 16:24:52 09/03/10 Fri [1]

Do you think I should try Charlie in sling early evening overnite till late morning see how he does. Let him out the rest of time? He gets so work up putting him back during the day, I am concern that he starting to hurt him self,You think that I was killing him the way he carries on.Its up setting to me and him. Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:43:56 09/03/10 Fri [1]

OK, I do understand how tiresome a long term treatment can
be both to the person doing the treating AND the bird on
the receiving end. Try overnight treatments with days free
for three days and observe the results. While he is free
he should be on either grass or carpet or other soft
non skid surface


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- Charlie Update, 09:50:26 09/14/10 Tue [1]

Hi I try Charlie for one day and felt it was to much for him. So he his out for hour and half in the morning and in the evening The rest of time in sling. He seem a lot more contented.I made a leg ban with a piece of wool and velcro on each end and it make easy for me to pull legs together and take of. Charlie is getting a little bit better each day He was trying to roll around in dirt the other day and even jumping around.When I go to put him back in his sling I have to chase after him now. {a slow chase} He still gets tried after agood half hour . Then his leg start turning then he lays down Left leg out to side. I dont no if this will change with time,Winter will be here soon in Canada I hope to have him in his own pen by November, Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Peachick Twisted leg -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 12:46:49 09/14/10 Tue [1]

Georgina, I am happy to hear that Charlie was able to jump
around and to enjoy a dust bath. It is wonderful that he
can be contented, too. It is VERY important to persist with
treatment while he is still fairly young because a time
comes when bones and joints have grown full size and
hardened into permanent shape. I sincerely hope that
Charlie can have bones and joints in shape soon.
It is great that you have persisted with treatment and kept
in touch with me. I appreciate it very much.


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[> Update on Charlie -- GEORGINA, 17:11:17 09/19/10 Sun [1]

Hello
I have sent you some more photos when you have a chance to view them.
Thanks Georgina


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[> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:03:20 09/19/10 Sun [1]

Got your email but instead of picture there was just a box
with a red "X" in it.
I replied to your email telling you this and if this
message does not come to you it means that your computer
rejected it as spam. Most computers reject any message from
sender that is not in address book which could explain the
problem that we had before. I have to keep mine open for
people in need of my advice so I have to delete a lot of
spam.


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[> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- Georgina, 09:11:58 09/20/10 Mon [1]

Hi I email pictures again hope you get them this time, Georgina


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[> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 11:50:21 09/20/10 Mon [1]

OK, Two emails arrived and took most of morning to down-
load onto my very slow old computer.
The photos are too large to go into the photo editor so I
have to scroll back and forth just to find the pictures--
which are way bigger than Charlie is.
I have been thinking of a treatment plan but will spend
more time looking at those photos before getting my mind
made up and typing it here. Right now I have shut down
computer and do my outdoor work. It will probably be quite
late tonight before I get back online.


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:04:34 09/20/10 Mon [1]

The toe nails on the bad leg need to be filed with nail
file or emory board.
-------
I know that the treatment plan is going to seem like going
back to square one.--the night time treatments--
Get a small kitchen sponge and wrap the hock joint holding
sponge in place with tape. Then tape legs together near
the feet. Put him in box with pillow under him for the
night (in a safe place)Remove sponge and tape each morning.
If any problem arises tell me right away. Otherwise just
give me a report every week.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- Georgina, 07:40:48 09/21/10 Tue [1]

Hi Should I wrap his wings at night? During the day do I still use sling? Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 09:30:30 09/21/10 Tue [1]

No, do not wrap wings at night because that would make him
less comfortable.
During day he needs to be able to move around--but if you
see him sitting with leg out to side you might rest him in
sling for a while and let him out later. At this point we
have to be making him independant. That is as independant
as a bird that lives in a secure pen can be. If he is
never able to use perch he might like a small tire such as
my Crazy Legs peahen uses at night. But I hope that he can
perch. I used to have an old peacock with bad hock joint
that slept on an extra wide perch (a 2"x 6") and he
braced his tail on a perch behind him.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- Georgina, 21:37:41 09/22/10 Wed [1]

Hi Well my husband helped me sponge and tape Charlie legs. I laid him on his pillow in a box. We had big flapping of wings then he finally settle down. Thought this is going well.So I left for a few minutes when I came back he was standing up, jumping up and down flapping his wings I just caught him as he was falling out of box. So I but him back in his sling with the sponge on and tape his feet together.So what do you think I should do now?It is amazing how much strength Charlie has when he is tick off. Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:27:31 09/22/10 Wed [1]

The wiry strength and determination to fight treatment are
are very normal for the peafowl species. I try to channel
these in useful ways. -- So that the energy of the struggle
puts pressure in right place to straighten the twisted
bone.
Sometimes there can be complete or partial success. The
goal is to get the bird able to walk without dragging body
on ground and keep the wings healthy, too.
----So if it is working better for you to have Charlie in
the sling with the taped legs that is the way to go....
at least for the night and perhaps for part of day.
But he MUST have some "free time" each day for his health
and happiness. The quality of life affects the will to
live.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- Georgina, 12:33:17 10/03/10 Sun [1]

Hi Charlie has improve alittle. the top of leg looks good when walking.From hock down it turn to side still. His hock joint look smaller to me. The strength is not there yet like his good leg.Is there any exercises I can do to strength that leg.When leg is tried its start turning. Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Update on Charlie -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:23:22 10/03/10 Sun [1]

To improve even a little is a victory. Charlie should not
be forced to exercise if he does not feel like doing it.
If there is any treat such as pieces of bread or romain
lettuce or brocali pieces that you could throw to far end
of his pen for him to chase if he enjoys it you could do
that.
A good dust bath could be relaxing. Sometimes I dig a hole
in the naturally sandy soil of my pens to encourage them to
get in and do some more digging. If your soil does not have
sand you could buy some play sand (packaged for children's
sand boxes)


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:47:21 11/02/10 Tue [1]

I exist to help birds like Charlie and do indeed want to
know "the rest of the story".
Even if it is not the way I would like it to be.
It is through feedback that I can improve my skill.
------
If you send me an email be certain to put "POULTRY"
in the subject line to avoid being lost in the spam filter


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:40:10 11/22/10 Mon [1]

Still hoping to get "the rest of the story".
it would make a great Christmas gift


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- Charlie, 16:04:19 12/17/10 Fri [1]

Hi Had a lot of family things going on here to deal with. Sorry, Charlie was doing quite well so I place him in a pen with Maggie.But it turn really cold and he started to go down hill.So I brought him back in to the house and started all over again. He could hardly walk.So he his in the sling at night time and made a pen with a rug on bottom during the day for about 3hrs. He has improve a little but not like he was before. Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:37:52 12/17/10 Fri [1]

Georgina, Thank you for the update. You have a kind heart.
Right now in the winter we all need love to keep us warm.
Love includes family, friends and pets. But most of all--
there is the love of God who gave us the gift of His Son.
MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY NEW YEAR.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:37:01 02/22/11 Tue [1]

Your friendly poultry orthpedist is still here waiting to
serve


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- Charlie, 09:47:04 03/19/11 Sat [1]

Hi Charlie Never really regain his walking he walks on his left hock with his leg twisted to the side. I took him to Guelph were they know about birds. He said there was nothing they could to for him he was to old. Then they said well may be we could brake his leg put pins in ,it might work.Do you want to spend that kind of money on him. So I took him home to spend some time with him. Had Charlie out side yesterday he love it. He has a lot of character and I love him dearly.It breaks my heart that I cannot make him better.I am really torn and sad Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:56:26 03/19/11 Sat [1]

Georgina, thank you for the update.
Even with his leg problem Charlie is blessed to have an
owner that loves him.
Murphy Peacock lived with me for seven years. Because
his hcck joint became bruised I kept a covering taped on
it. But right now I have a peahen named Crazy Legs several
years old who needs no padding on bad leg. She lives in
private pen. (Am in Georgia, USA where winter is not so
severe) She sleeps on a small tire from all terrain
vehicle. She even lays a few eggs in the breeding season
but these are not fertile because I would not risk
having a peacock in her pen. She seems satisfied with her
home and reasonably comfortable.
I hope that Charlie stays able to walk.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- Charlie walking leg brace?, 08:13:14 03/30/11 Wed [1]

Hi Is there such a thing has a walking leg brace for Charlie? My Husband said we should put him down. I just can not do that at this time with out trying everything.I saw on TV a story about a cow who had one leg at the knee turn back, THe farmer made him a walking spint from knee down. He was walking. Any suggestion would be greatly appreciated. Georgina


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 12:21:12 03/30/11 Wed [1]

As long as a creature is not suffering from pain and is
able to eat....it can be kept as a pet by someone who loves
it. But if somebody else wants to know why waste all this
effort of giving special care--there is scientific proof
that holding a pet causes the person's body to secrete
endorphins (that make you feel good and even relieve your
own pain)...and even performing a good deed causes those
endorphins)
I made special pads for Murphy's hock joints that were so
effective that the sores healed.
But the hinged leg brace I made for Lame Tiger was a
disaster. But even with that brace in the cabinet with
other junk Lame Tiger was able to be the father of a few
offspring.
But in order for me to give new advice for Charkie I need
new photos of both legs from all sides.
Do not send too many photos in one email due to the
extreme slowness of my old computer. I remember that my
email seems to be blocked from your computer. Perhaps
there is an over aggressive spam filter in the way that
could be adjusted to fix that. But I am satisfied to keep
all the story here for others to read.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR HOW CHARLIE IS DOING -- Charlie photos, 13:43:49 03/30/11 Wed [1]

My daughter is coming home on April 4th I will email you pictures of Charlies legs then, Thanks Georgina


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paralised legs on chicken -- c raffo, 18:34:54 03/25/11 Fri [3]

our hen suddenly developed paralised legs. we have had her living inside in a dog crate for 2 weeks now keeping her warm and helping her with feeding. think may be Mareks from description we have read and have followed advise given for that. No improvement still but hope there is something else we can try. she has not given up on us.


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Replies:

[> Re: paralised legs on chicken -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:40:05 03/25/11 Fri [1]

Yes, could be Marek's disease...which sometimes is fatal
but sometimes the victim will recover after being given
loving care. Marek's most often occurs in young adult.
You did not mention the age of this hen.
A bit of prednisone can help heal the inflamed nerves.
Also vitamin B-complex,vitamins C and E are good, too.
Green leafy vegetables such as cabbage, collards broccali
can be served raw and chopped finely. Hard boiled egg is
good, too.


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[> [> Re: paralised legs on chicken -- c raffo, 19:56:35 03/26/11 Sat [1]

thanks for that. Have had Hennie on antibios and anti inflammatory from vet for over a week now. She is approx 3 years, and we inherited her about 6 months ago. Will get her started on vits asap, and will continue hand feeding anything she fancies. Grapes seem to be favourite. Havent made sling yet, but will give that a try tomorrow. Am grateful for any advice as we have only been keeping hens for 18months, and now have 19 hens and 1 handsome cockerel. Get some lovely eggs each day. We are in Somerset England. Many thanks.


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[> [> [> Re: paralised legs on chicken -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:17:10 03/27/11 Sun [1]

You are welcome. I exist to serve my Creator by helping His
most helpless creatures. I have lived in Georgia, USA since
1975. Grapes, especially the purple ones have been in the
news for helping humans stay young and healthy so must be
good for chickens, too.
Please keep me updated on Hennie's progress


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stumbling chick -- Rosie (desperate), 22:51:13 02/27/11 Sun [10]

Hi, I was just given a chick 3 weeks old, had spraddle/splay legs that were hobbled to fix them, but it didn't work. Now I have him and his lower legs are a too close together while his upper legs (above the hocks) are too far apart, he looks like a jockey or a soccer player and walks on the outside of his feet and stumbles a lot. Is this something that could be fixed with a sponge brace or is the chick too old now? Thanks for your help.


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Replies:

[> Re: stumbling chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:50:50 02/28/11 Mon [1]

It would help if I could see those legs. Can you photo-
graph them close up and post photo on a website such as
villagephotos.com or photobucket? Then put the link to them
here. Or you can try emailing photos directly to me IF
the file is not too big for my old slow computer. Also you
could email me to get my phone number to discuss details
of making and taping a sponge brace. A three week old chick
will be difficult to repair but there is a possibility of
success. Several years ago I spent a whole month with a
messed up bantam cockerel before all his parts were
pointed in the right direction.


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[> [> Re: stumbling chick -- Rosie, 14:27:25 02/28/11 Mon [1]

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2011-2/1364823/0
I think this is the address, hope it works...


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[> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:43:41 02/28/11 Mon [1]

Yes, I saw the pictures. There appears to be damage to the
hock joints and the Achilles tendons displaced. There is
the bruising that comes from the chick struggling to walk
on the damaged joints. The joints were a bit hard for me to
see but I saw them well enough to be reasonably certain of
what is wrong.
-----
This probably began as the chick was hatching--as it was
kicking its way out of the eggshell and the Achilles
tendons slipped out of place. If it had been treated on
the same day the tendons might have been put back in place
but each day of struggling made the problem worse as the
joint became inflamed and filled with fluid.
I regret that I can offer no hope of a cure.


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[> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- Rosie, 11:17:54 03/01/11 Tue [1]

Is there anything I should do? Can it keep living like this?


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[> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- Rosie, 19:36:35 03/01/11 Tue [1]

The bruising of the hocks only appeared within the last few days and he doesn't seem to be that uncomfortable.


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:43:56 03/01/11 Tue [1]

There are ways to make the chick comfortable IF you have
the time and the determination to do so. Some crippled
birds are able to adjust to being a special pet.
But it takes a heart full of love and the understanding
that your pet may have a short life span.
---------
I have held and comforted my "failures".
In fact I deliver sudden death only when I see that the
bird is suffering and has no hope of feeling better.
----
The sudden removal of the head is the kindest way to kill
a suffering bird.
You can keep your pet comfortable for a few days while you
make up your mind about it. If you keep yout pet I can
give you ways to make it comfortable


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- Rosie, 11:08:05 03/02/11 Wed [1]

Oh, I definitely want to keep him. I know at some point it may get to be too much but at present I have the time and he's just sooo cute, especially when he falls asleep in my hand.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:29:54 03/03/11 Thu [1]

Best wishes to you and your chick. If your chick has any
new problems or if there are any questions just ask.
If my old computer is still working I will try to answer.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- Rosie, 11:10:24 03/04/11 Fri [1]

You said there are some ways to make it more comfortable. Do you have any tips? Thanks


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: stumbling chick -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:32:14 03/04/11 Fri [1]

If the chick is still able to walk as it was in the photos-
it needs a non skid surface under its feet such as carpet
or a towel. For night a soft little nest box.
Of course it is very important to keep the bird's feathers
and feet clean.
Food is important, too. Besides the normal medicated chick
starter small quantities of raw chopped green vegetables
should be supplied along with a bit of hard boiled egg.
The eggshell can be pulverized for a source of calcium.
If mealworms are available two or three of them would make
a great treat.
----
A bird that can not walk or stand up needs a padded chick
chair or body sling. I hope that your chick will not need
this.
----
If you are reading or talking on phone you can hold the
chick while doing this.
----
one more thing--always protect the bird from predators
such as possums, foxes, rats, hawks, and even cats and dogs
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure


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GED Alternative -- GED Alternative, 20:23:49 02/21/11 Mon [1]

Great post! Here's a link for an alternative to a GED online.

http://www.freeonlineged.org


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High School Diploma -- sfhd, 03:58:48 11/22/10 Mon [1]

The General Education Development (GED or GED Online) testing program permits adult students to apply for an equivalency certificate. At Sandford High School you can earn yourself a regular High School Diploma which is better than a General Education Development program. Once you have a regular diploma, you can apply for better jobs rather than if you had a GED, GED Online. There are many GED Schools or organizations that would prefer a Regular High School Diploma as compared to Online Diploma or GED Online. So why go through the hassle of getting a GED when you can earn yourself an accredited regular diploma.


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High School Diploma -- sfhd, 03:42:02 11/02/10 Tue [1]

Recognized GED Online. Get Online Diploma by passing GED Equivalence Test and your high school diploma online from accredited GED Schools.


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Picking Hens -- Ruth, 14:31:43 10/15/10 Fri [1]

We have 12 Cinnamon Queens, about 2yrs old, that are picking feathers off of one another. Most of them have no feathers on the back end and down the center of their backs. Now that winter is approaching, I would like to see them get their feathers back so they can withstand the colder weather. Do you have any idea why they do this and how I can stop them?

Thank you for you help.


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Replies:

[> Re: Picking Hens -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 20:53:15 10/15/10 Fri [1]

Feather picking can be caused by being crowded in pen that
is too small. It is good to provide hiding places.
Also they can be given something else to pick such as
cabbages or other vegetables or fruit. Some dry cat food
will give extra protein to encourage feather growth....
and perhaps make them less hungry for feathers.


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High School Diploma -- sfhd, 02:44:48 09/23/10 Thu [1]

Recognized Online GED. Get Online Diploma by passing GED Equivalence Test and your High School Diploma online from accredited SandfordHighSchool.


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4 month old banty chick's one leg after amputation -- Marty Dukes (Darlin), 16:40:21 09/13/10 Mon [3]

I have a four month old Banty chick that was stepped on at one month old. Eventually, her left leg began to cross over to the right, prohibiting her from walking. I have just had the left leg amputated. She's doing well and seems content enough. She's trying to get up on the right leg. What can I do to assist in strengthening the right leg to where she might can hop on one leg? She is a pet, but I would like to see her ambulate again. Thank you.


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Replies:

[> Re: 4 month old banty chick's one leg after amputation -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:09:19 09/13/10 Mon [1]

You can make a "body sling" for her to rest in while
healing. This can be made from cloth such as an old
T-shirt hung in a cardboard box. Cut two leg holes.
(am guessing that part of amputated leg is still there)
Also cut a hole for manure to fall through.
Hang this so that the foot can touch the surface below.
She will kick and excercise as she sits in this.
You can put food and water where she can reach it.


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[> [> Re: 4 month old banty chick's one leg after amputation -- marty dukes, 23:14:16 09/13/10 Mon [1]

THANK YOU!


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[> [> [> Re: 4 month old banty chick's one leg after amputation -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 12:26:12 09/14/10 Tue [1]

You are welcome.
I exist to serve my Creator by helping His most helpless
creatures


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Older duck with leg problems -- azduckranch, 12:28:01 08/22/10 Sun [1]

I have a duck about 3 years old (I estimate). She is our favorite as she doesn't mind us picking her up and will eat out of our hands when we are holding her. She has a hard time walking. Both her legs are swollen at the knee and above. Her yellow skin has formed numerous black spots. She gets around OK but slowly, lifting herself with her bill to stand. When she sits she usually places her legs out straight to the rear.
Do you have any idea what this might be? We have given her a twice a day oral antibiotic for a week. It seems to help a little but she never seems to progress or regress. Any suggestions for further treatment? Thank you.


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Replies:

[> Re: Older duck with leg problems -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:23:01 08/22/10 Sun [1]

Your duck needs to see a veterinarian (preferably one with
poultry experience) to diagnose the problem and prescribe
the right medication.


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sandpaper shell eggs -- helen, 12:37:29 08/18/10 Wed [7]

Hi DCT, i hope i found you? You've helped me on other forums about peafowl. Can you or anyone else help me re chickens? I have two hybrid 3 year old hens - one at least has started to lay eggs that have a rough sandpaper like textured outer shell - not at all smooth as they have been for the last three years. They seem fine other than that - i have them on a layers pellet which they have been on for years - plus green veg. Should i be worried about them? thank you, Helen in the UK


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Replies:

[> Re: sandpaper shell eggs -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:14:03 08/18/10 Wed [1]

Helen, you are welcome.
Do you mean that the eggshells have extra calcium on top of
regular shells or is the shell just a membrane?
When chickens or other poultry lay soft shelled eggs they
either lack calcium or lack the ability to absorb calcium.
Crushed oystershells are commonly fed to laying hens.
A poultry lab doctor told me to give cod liver oil to a
peahen that was laying soft shelled eggs even though she
had plenty of oyster shell.
I have some old chickens that lay weird eggs...due to the
fact that I run a home for useless, violent or otherwise
dysfunctional poultry here in the USA


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[> [> Re: sandpaper shell eggs -- helen, 04:59:40 08/19/10 Thu [1]

Thank you! the eggs look normal and the shells are a normal thickness but the external surface of the shell is not smooth like normal; it feels rough in texture: like sandpaper....that can't be comfortable to lay! Just wondered if it was an indication that anything was wrong?


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[> [> [> Re: sandpaper shell eggs -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 11:14:02 08/19/10 Thu [1]

You are welcome. I exist to serve my Creator by helping His
most helpless creatures.
But I do NOT know the answer to your question.....might be
able to find it by asking a former poultry lab doctor.
Actually I have seen this on eggs from my own chickens but
those chickens do not seem to be suffering.


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[> [> [> Re: sandpaper shell eggs -- helen, 14:33:35 08/19/10 Thu [1]

You are such a wonderful help: to us and to all your poultry and peafowl - i have read your posts for years and I know not all your birds (demonstrate that they)are as grateful to you as they should be :)
Plesase don't worry to ask for me as mine don't seem to be suffering at all either: i am just eager to learn as much as i can to help my birds have a full and happy life. If i find the answer i will mail you :)


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[> [> [> [> Re: sandpaper shell eggs--THE ANSWER -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 21:45:00 08/19/10 Thu [1]

Helen, I sent an email to that former poultry lab doctor
and he was kind enough to send a very prompt reply.
He told me that it is best to supply oyster shell
and to use feed that has NO calcium in it so that the hen
can choose how much to eat.....
and while that was fresh on my mind I went and got the tag
from my layer pellet bag to see if my own hens were being
over supplied with calcium. Calcium is listed in the
analysis of ingredients. Makes me wonder if I can find a
layer pellet variety with no calcium


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: sandpaper shell eggs--THE ANSWER -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:02:20 08/19/10 Thu [1]

OOPS, forgot part of message..........
Decreasing light can be a problem with eggs also, so that, again, as egg frequency drops, birds in the habit and metabolic makeup for daily laying sometimes lay eggs with thick sandpaper shells


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: sandpaper shell eggs--THE ANSWER -- helen, 06:00:43 08/20/10 Fri [1]

thank you so much. Yes, decreasing light makes sense. Here in the uk our summer feels like it is coming to an early end :( The decreasing light levels are already very apparent to me and my peafowl are roosting very early in the evening.
I will investigate about the food without calcium. Best wishes to you and all your avian guests!


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goose with dislocated hips/ legs? getting in bad shape -- rebecca lemon, 02:42:26 07/26/10 Mon [1]

hi,
i have a goose (abt 2 months old) who has had problems w/ her legs since she hatched. i got her after she was already abt a month old, and when she got wet (she was sticky so she had a bath) i noticed that on one side of her body there was a muscle/tendon/ligament tha was preventing the leg from straightening out completely. fast forward to now, she has managed to injure herself pretty regularly and the most recent time, she messed her legs up so that walking is no longer an option. the best way to describe it is that her legs are like those of a small doll whose legs have worn down the ball joint that holds them in place so the legs just dangle when you try to make them go up. she now has one leg that folds under her at a weird angle, and the other sticks out to the side, and she can't bend it (or won't). she learned to swim like a crab, but her legs don't go down. is there a way to set them in place? i had her using a swing abt a week ago, but i don't want her to hurt if it doesn't work. plz help me, her poor body is purple from the bruising and she's an absolute cutie when she's not getting hurt. thanks for your time and your input.


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Replies:

[> Re: goose with dislocated hips/ legs? getting in bad shape -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 08:38:03 07/26/10 Mon [1]

Rebecca, I wish that I could help you with your goose but
my poultry orthopedic methods work best on newly hatched
poultry. Your poor goose has problems for which I have NO
"methods".
I have a peahen named Crazy Legs that is able to move
herself around her small pen and perch on a tire. I do not
have a male with her because that could hurt her.
What I am saying is that some crippled birds can live as
pets. Some have died naturally but sometimes when one is
suffering I have had to use a freshly sharpened hatchet to
very suddenly remove head. This is the best way to put an
end to a suffering bird.
You will have to decide what is best for your goose.


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Poult's problem -- Ruth, 23:51:08 07/23/10 Fri [1]


I used a new blade and cut the base of the bubble. Unfortunately, the turkey moved when I cut and the opening became 1/2" instead of 1/4". I don't think it went deep. I didn't see any signs of blood, only a little fluid. I did not put anything on it. The hatchery suggested "Ocean Blue". Unless you can suggest something else, I'll pick it up tomorrow.

It is interesting that you mentioned a possible injury when it was smaller. This turkey (Narragansett) was in the cage with the turkey (Big White) that had its wing pulled out by a opossum and died two days later after having lost so much blood (I wrote you about him about a month ago.) It is possible that the opossum grabbed at this one and we didn't realize it. I do hope this one makes it.

By the way, she seems to be panting less but now I think the gunieas may be pecking on her head as some of the feathers are gone or could it be molting?

Thank you once again.
Ruth


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Replies:

[> Re: Poult's problem -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 10:21:42 07/24/10 Sat [1]

Ruth, you are welcome. I exist to serve my Creator by
helping His most helpless creatures.

I would NOT want to have guineas with that poult. I used to
have guineas so I know how aggressive they can be.
In fact I had a male guinea named "Chainsaw" who weighed
only three and a half pounds but could strike terror into
the heart of a thirty five pound male turkey (bronze
of mixed ancestry). But in recent years I have only
chickens and peafowls.
I hope that your poult's skin gets a better hold on its
body to keep the air in the passages where it belongs.
If you have to cut again try to do it in the center of the
blister. Any brand of antibiotic ointment is good.
Ordinary white sugar or honey will kill germs....
and did you know that sugar is good for stopping bleeding?
The sap of fresh cut aloe vera leaf is friendly to skin--
yours, mine and our poultry's.


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Poults problem -- Ruth, 13:49:14 07/23/10 Fri [1]

I tried to expel the air on the wing by using an upholstery needle. Every time the turkey peeped, the sac expanded and remained enlarged. When I broke the one on its body, the air released but expanded again when the turkey peeped. There is a small amount of bubbly fluid in the sac.

After I tried this treatment (approximately 3 minutes time elapsed from "catch to finish",) the turkey would not move.
I am afraid to cut the sac, now that I know there is bubbling fluid in the bubble.

I am going to try to locate a farm extension bureau someplace in Missouri. In the meantime, do you have anymore suggestions?

Ruth


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Replies:

[> Re: Poults problem -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:00:01 07/23/10 Fri [1]

At least now it seems reasonably certain that this really is a problem with the air escaping from lungs and the air
sac in hollow bones. But I wish that the cure could have
been as simple as it was for my peachick. His problem began
as soon as he was hatched. Perhaps the hatching chicken
stepped on him or maybe not. I had to prick him several
times in the first two weeks of his life--until his skin
became firmly attached to his body like it should be.
---How old is this poult?


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Poults problem -- Ruth, 12:25:01 07/23/10 Fri [1]

Thank you once again.
The blister looks like it is filled with air, like a bubble gum bubble. This seems logical to break it..I'll try now.
Do I treat the cut?
Ruth


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Poult's problem -- Ruth, 15:07:58 07/22/10 Thu [1]

Can you tell me what can cause a blister about 1 1/4" round by 3/4" high to form on the underside of a poults wing, about an inch from the joint that connects it to the body? There is also one about one inch long, by 1/2" wide, by 1/4" high on the body side, opposite of the large blister.

I have called the hatchery and they couldn't help me. I asked if there was a vet that treated poultry in our area and there are none. I know that this is not your field of expertise but having worked with poultry, you may have some insight on this problem. Is there anything that can be done to help her?
Thank you for past and present help!


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Replies:

[> Re: Poult's problem -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:13:41 07/22/10 Thu [1]

Ruth, I wish that I had a quick easy answer. Are these
blisters filled with fluid? If so it might be possible to
drain them by pricking with needle or corner of razor
blade. Years ago I had a newly hatched peachick that had an
air bubble under its skin that came from system that
provides for the air in hollow bird bones (the reason that
birds are light enough to fly). That peachick was in great
pain and stress until I used corner of razor blade to just
make a tiny prick in th skin that let the air escape. The
relief from pain was so great that he stretched out on my
hand and went to sleep. The air bubble did come back
several times but I just repeated the treatment. Finally
the problem went away.
But if this is not what is wrong with your poult....I
wonder if you live in a state that has poultry labs.
Here in Georgia there is a huge poultry industry so this
state has several of them with vets who are poultry
specialists.


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Chicken with straddle legs -- Jenni (confused), 21:27:00 07/12/10 Mon [1]

Hello there. I have a chicken who is about a month & 1/2 old. It has had straddle legs since it was very young. I have been taping the legs together at the end (what is known as the hobble brace) with no luck. The chicken has shown no improvement to this method, and I am at a loss what to do next. The chicken is confined to a cage by itself, to prevent the other chickens from attacking it, but it seems like no life to a chicken. Please let me know if there are any other methods out there to correct this disorder. Thank you.


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Replies:

[> Re: Chicken with straddle legs -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:21:26 07/12/10 Mon [1]

This is NOT a normal case of straddle legs. When a newly
hatched chick is treated with the hobble brace it will
normally be cured in a day....and if not there has to be
something else wrong with it--either weakness from a
disease or paralysis--or displaced Achilles tendon.
Or even a case of twisted tibia. Am guessing here and
trying to cover all possibilities.
But whatever it is treatment of a bird as old as yours is
difficult or impossible. I wish I had a better answer.


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young goose w/ leg issues needs atten ASAP -- rebecca, 19:19:40 07/11/10 Sun [1]

hi,
i posted a message abt my baby goose who had leg issues and was unable to stand and walk. well, we gave her oyster shells, egg shells, and gravel w/ calcium and it's gotten worse. now, the leg i thought was the good one twists so that the foot is behind her back. her other leg just kind of folds forward, and she can't stand at all w/ out help. i tried to make a sling, and for some reason her hips just twist so she's kind of doing the splits. she was super dirty so i gave her a little bath and i noticed on her right side, there seems to be a large (either tendon, muscle, or tissue) that runs along her side. it's pretty obvious. what would u think it is? i can try to send a pic if u need one.

do u knw of any type of harness, walker, etc for her? i can't hold her up and when i try to use towels or whatever to hold her up, she twists and ends up all messed up on the floor. can i give her milk for her to get calcium?

thanks for ur info and input, i've asked the local pet stores and they are all idiots. our vets r not really poultry people, so they haven't been helpful.

hope to hear from u soon!

rebecca


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Replies:

[> Re: young goose w/ leg issues needs atten ASAP -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:34:12 07/11/10 Sun [1]

Rebecca,
I regret that I have no treatments for these problems in a
goose as big and old as yours is by now


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Hen with a broken wing -- Cindy, 19:45:48 07/07/10 Wed [1]

I have a laying hen with a broken wing. I have a young Great pyenise and he wanted to play with her. Her wingflight feathers drag the ground. I was wanting to know if I could clip them without hurting her.


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Replies:

[> Re: Hen with a broken wing -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:52:16 07/07/10 Wed [1]

please DO NOT CLIP THOSE WING FEATHERS!!!!!!!!!
--------
the standard treatment for broken wing (approved by a
poultry lab doctor) is:
Very gently fold the broken wing in normal position against
the bird's body. Then put tape around the wing feathers to
keep the broken wing folded. Last of all put tape around
the broken wing to hold it against the body-- being certain
to leave the unbroken wing free to help the injured bird
keep its balance


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Opossum pulled wing of young turkey -- Ruth, 21:30:47 07/06/10 Tue [1]

I'm sorry to say that the turkey died this afternoon.
I still would like to know what could have been done in case this happens again.
Thank you,
Ruth


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Replies:

[> Re: Opossum pulled wing of young turkey -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 22:33:22 07/06/10 Tue [1]

Am sorry that the turkey died. It is likely that there was
no way to save it. Plain ordinary white sugar can be used
as a blood stopper. The good thing about sugar is that it
also kills germs by drawing water out of them. This is why
jelly and jam have high sugar content to prevent spoiling.
-----------
I have an adult chicken that is permanently lame after
surviving an attack by an old male possum. She would be
dead if the animal had bitten her throat instead of her
leg. She was able to make enough noise to get me out of bed
to rescue her. But the bite was deep and slow healing.
That possum died from a close encounter with a grumpy old
person


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Opossum pulled wing of young turkey -- Ruth, 14:07:15 07/06/10 Tue [1]

Last night an opossum got into the quarantine area of the barn. We had an 8 week old turkey in a cage as she had diarrhea all day. The cage wire was wide enough that the opossum could get to the turkey's wing. It tried to pull it thru the wire and pulled the bottom part of the wing loose instead. It looks like it is in shock. I am going to try to medicate it and bandage the area but beyond that, I don't know what else to do. Do you have any suggestions?

Thank you!


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Peachick toe might be broken -- Erica Ashton (Worried), 08:07:29 07/06/10 Tue [1]

I have a two month old peachick that has one outer tow that looks like it might be broken. It is not in the usual position that the other toes are in. It is bent at the middle (looks like a joint on a finger now) and points backward instead of front side position. Can this be made better again?

Thanks
Erica


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Replies:

[> Re: Peachick toe might be broken -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 09:01:48 07/06/10 Tue [1]

If that toe really is broken it can be splinted by taping
on a "chick shoe" but if it has grown in this bent
position to the age of two months it may be too late to
change it. So the question is--did this just happen now?
Or you can check this toe and see if it feels broken or
solid. If it is broken try making and taping on the "shoe"
or just a "half shoe" that would go on the broken toe and
the middle toe. Find picture of this in my article
www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/1/


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NOTICE TO EVERYBODY -- D. C. Townsend, 23:38:12 05/30/10 Sun [6]

this forum is here for people that want help with poultry
orthopedic problems.


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Replies:

[> NO TRESSPASSING!!! -- D. C. Townsend, 10:54:30 06/03/10 Thu [1]

THIS FORUM IS FOR PEOPLE WITH PET POULTRY.
------
SELLERS OF WATCHES OR PAYROLL SERVICES WILL NOT BE
TOLERATED


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[> [> AM RETIRED---NO PAYROLL -- D. C. Townsend, 11:01:44 06/08/10 Tue [1]

how many times must I say that this forum is for people
with poultry and NOT for pests with payroll calculators?


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[> [> [> Re: AM RETIRED---NO PAYROLL -- D C T--NOT friendly to this, 09:39:37 06/10/10 Thu [1]

HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU??????????


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[> [> [> Re: AM RETIRED---NO PAYROLL -- D. C. Townsend, 08:41:13 07/04/10 Sun [1]

It was some evil calculating for the Online Calculator to
strike on the Fourth of July


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[> I need help! -- jen, 13:49:26 07/04/10 Sun [1]

I have a baby chick. Its hock joint is out and I keep reading about how to stretch it and sling it and put a straw around it. but I am very nervous that I don't know what i am doing! can anyone help walk me through this? I rescued a hen last year from getting killed, both feet were like this one healed..She has done well but only ably to use one leg! This new chick is not thriving like the other did and I am worried. Thanks for getting back to me as soon as you can!


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[> [> Re: I need help! -- D C T--friendly poultry orthopedist, 23:32:59 07/04/10 Sun [1]

I think you mean that the Achilles tendon is displaced.
This keeps hock joint from moving properly. Sometimes when
this problem is treated as soon as it happens it is
possible to gently push the tendon to the center of the
joint. (the tendon is at the rear of the joint)
If the chick has struggled for a few days there will be
swelling that prevents the tendon from staying in place.
In that case the chick needs to rest in a "chick chair"


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