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Subject: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Wes
[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]
Date Posted: 13:25:35 10/14/14 Tue

Another column picked up from the paper. I've touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a little, but other than that it's absolutely true.

-- Wes


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system. She’s used it a little, but I haven’t very much, since I rarely drive anywhere these days when I don’t know where I’m going because I’ve been there before. Oh, once in a while I will go to a race track I’ve never been to before and I have to glance at a map, but that’s pretty rare.

The other day I had to drive her car up to a town I'll call Flatburg. I was by myself, so I thought I’d give the GPS a fair trial. Now, I know how to get to Flatburg. I’ve known it for fifty years or more, so it wasn’t as if I really needed the help. To get to Flatburg, you drive north up the highway until you get to the interstate, go west, and wait until you get to the sign that says “Flatburg.” Very simple. Even a child could do it. Right.

I managed to get the thing turned on somewhere north of town on the highway. That’s something I don’t recommend trying to do while you’re driving by yourself, by the way. Almost as soon as I had it on, a girl’s voice told me to turn right on a small dirt road.

“You’re crazy,” I yelled at the stupid machine. “Why would I want to go down a dirt road a mile out of the way when where I’m going is right ahead of me on the highway?”

So, I ignored it. After I passed the dirt road, in a rather snotty voice the machine said, “Recalculating,” but in a tone I took to mean, “Why didn’t you listen to me the first time, stupid?”

In the next five miles or so it managed to keep from sending me down every cross road I passed, but after that it didn’t get a thing right. Not once. I would have shut the stupid thing off, except I sort of wanted to see just how bad it was going to be. The answer was “not merely bad, but downright awful.”

The dumb machine tried to send me off course at every intersection we came to. Every one! Once it tried to send me down a road that was abandoned when I was a kid. You might have been able to get down it in a Jeep with four-wheel drive and a chainsaw. Another time it tried to get me off at an intersection that never existed with a road that didn’t cross.

By now, I was laughing at every wrong intersection, sometimes shouting things like “You @#$%^&* idiot!” at the machine. (Yes, I talk to machines. I’ve always done it. Get over it.)

It did get the exit from the interstate at Flatburg correct -- but only because the dumb machine had been trying to get me off the interstate at every intersection from the highway onward. That counts as a “little boy who cried wolf” problem. Even that didn’t count, since as soon as I was on the side road, it tried to get me to go back east on the interstate.

It did miss trying to send me down a few wrong side streets once I was in Flatburg, but only a few. I finally hit a point at an intersection where my destination was clearly in sight in the block to the left. You guessed it: it sent me to the right.

Now, my son-in-law has pointed out that the machine may have inadvertently been set to the wrong destination. I don’t think so; I had it set for a destination that was already on the machine and there weren’t a lot of choices.

I will say the machine was pretty good about telling me where I was. Telling me how to get where I wanted to go, it was abysmally, hysterically wrong. So, I learned something from that: don’t trust GPS directions. I mean, I knew where I was going, so I knew it was wrong. But what if I didn’t know where I was going?

I may be old-fashioned and cantankerous, but I think I’ll stick with paper maps, thank you.

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
wexwiz543
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 19:52:14 10/14/14 Tue

A GPS is only as good as the software that runs it is created. It sounds like the software doesn't know about small towns. Too many people have been misled when they rely totally on a GPS.
Look at the strange instructions you get from mapquest to get between two points.

I tell my students caveat peremptory. At least look at a map before you trust your GPS. There have been too many stories in the news lately about people nearly dieing because they were misled by a GPS.

Wex

>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>
>-- Wes

>
>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>-

>
>Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system. She’s used
>it a little, but I haven’t very much, since I rarely
>drive anywhere these days when I don’t know where I’m
>going because I’ve been there before. Oh, once in a
>while I will go to a race track I’ve never been to
>before and I have to glance at a map, but that’s
>pretty rare.
>
>The other day I had to drive her car up to a town I'll
>call Flatburg. I was by myself, so I thought I’d give
>the GPS a fair trial. Now, I know how to get to
>Flatburg. I’ve known it for fifty years or more, so it
>wasn’t as if I really needed the help. To get to
>Flatburg, you drive north up the highway until you get
>to the interstate, go west, and wait until you get to
>the sign that says “Flatburg.” Very simple. Even a
>child could do it. Right.
>
>I managed to get the thing turned on somewhere north
>of town on the highway. That’s something I don’t
>recommend trying to do while you’re driving by
>yourself, by the way. Almost as soon as I had it on, a
>girl’s voice told me to turn right on a small dirt
>road.
>
>“You’re crazy,” I yelled at the stupid machine. “Why
>would I want to go down a dirt road a mile out of the
>way when where I’m going is right ahead of me on the
>highway?”
>
>So, I ignored it. After I passed the dirt road, in a
>rather snotty voice the machine said, “Recalculating,”
>but in a tone I took to mean, “Why didn’t you listen
>to me the first time, stupid?”
>
>In the next five miles or so it managed to keep from
>sending me down every cross road I passed, but after
>that it didn’t get a thing right. Not once. I would
>have shut the stupid thing off, except I sort of
>wanted to see just how bad it was going to be. The
>answer was “not merely bad, but downright awful.”
>
>The dumb machine tried to send me off course at every
>intersection we came to. Every one! Once it tried to
>send me down a road that was abandoned when I was a
>kid. You might have been able to get down it in a Jeep
>with four-wheel drive and a chainsaw. Another time it
>tried to get me off at an intersection that never
>existed with a road that didn’t cross.
>
>By now, I was laughing at every wrong intersection,
>sometimes shouting things like “You @#$%^&* idiot!” at
>the machine. (Yes, I talk to machines. I’ve always
>done it. Get over it.)
>
>It did get the exit from the interstate at Flatburg
>correct -- but only because the dumb machine had been
>trying to get me off the interstate at every
>intersection from the highway onward. That counts as a
>“little boy who cried wolf” problem. Even that didn’t
>count, since as soon as I was on the side road, it
>tried to get me to go back east on the interstate.
>
>It did miss trying to send me down a few wrong side
>streets once I was in Flatburg, but only a few. I
>finally hit a point at an intersection where my
>destination was clearly in sight in the block to the
>left. You guessed it: it sent me to the right.
>
>Now, my son-in-law has pointed out that the machine
>may have inadvertently been set to the wrong
>destination. I don’t think so; I had it set for a
>destination that was already on the machine and there
>weren’t a lot of choices.
>
>I will say the machine was pretty good about telling
>me where I was. Telling me how to get where I wanted
>to go, it was abysmally, hysterically wrong. So, I
>learned something from that: don’t trust GPS
>directions. I mean, I knew where I was going, so I
>knew it was wrong. But what if I didn’t know where I
>was going?
>
>I may be old-fashioned and cantankerous, but I think
>I’ll stick with paper maps, thank you.
[> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
wexwiz543
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 19:54:37 10/14/14 Tue

Premptory!? Darn foiled by automatic spell check should be caveat emptor

Wex

>A GPS is only as good as the software that runs it is
>created. It sounds like the software doesn't know
>about small towns. Too many people have been misled
>when they rely totally on a GPS.
>Look at the strange instructions you get from mapquest
>to get between two points.
>
>I tell my students caveat peremptory. At least look at
>a map before you trust your GPS. There have been too
>many stories in the news lately about people nearly
>dieing because they were misled by a GPS.
>
>Wex
>
>>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>>
>>-- Wes

>>
>>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>>-

>>
>>Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system. She’s used
>>it a little, but I haven’t very much, since I rarely
>>drive anywhere these days when I don’t know where I’m
>>going because I’ve been there before. Oh, once in a
>>while I will go to a race track I’ve never been to
>>before and I have to glance at a map, but that’s
>>pretty rare.
>>
>>The other day I had to drive her car up to a town I'll
>>call Flatburg. I was by myself, so I thought I’d give
>>the GPS a fair trial. Now, I know how to get to
>>Flatburg. I’ve known it for fifty years or more, so it
>>wasn’t as if I really needed the help. To get to
>>Flatburg, you drive north up the highway until you get
>>to the interstate, go west, and wait until you get to
>>the sign that says “Flatburg.” Very simple. Even a
>>child could do it. Right.
>>
>>I managed to get the thing turned on somewhere north
>>of town on the highway. That’s something I don’t
>>recommend trying to do while you’re driving by
>>yourself, by the way. Almost as soon as I had it on, a
>>girl’s voice told me to turn right on a small dirt
>>road.
>>
>>“You’re crazy,” I yelled at the stupid machine. “Why
>>would I want to go down a dirt road a mile out of the
>>way when where I’m going is right ahead of me on the
>>highway?”
>>
>>So, I ignored it. After I passed the dirt road, in a
>>rather snotty voice the machine said, “Recalculating,”
>>but in a tone I took to mean, “Why didn’t you listen
>>to me the first time, stupid?”
>>
>>In the next five miles or so it managed to keep from
>>sending me down every cross road I passed, but after
>>that it didn’t get a thing right. Not once. I would
>>have shut the stupid thing off, except I sort of
>>wanted to see just how bad it was going to be. The
>>answer was “not merely bad, but downright awful.”
>>
>>The dumb machine tried to send me off course at every
>>intersection we came to. Every one! Once it tried to
>>send me down a road that was abandoned when I was a
>>kid. You might have been able to get down it in a Jeep
>>with four-wheel drive and a chainsaw. Another time it
>>tried to get me off at an intersection that never
>>existed with a road that didn’t cross.
>>
>>By now, I was laughing at every wrong intersection,
>>sometimes shouting things like “You @#$%^&* idiot!” at
>>the machine. (Yes, I talk to machines. I’ve always
>>done it. Get over it.)
>>
>>It did get the exit from the interstate at Flatburg
>>correct -- but only because the dumb machine had been
>>trying to get me off the interstate at every
>>intersection from the highway onward. That counts as a
>>“little boy who cried wolf” problem. Even that didn’t
>>count, since as soon as I was on the side road, it
>>tried to get me to go back east on the interstate.
>>
>>It did miss trying to send me down a few wrong side
>>streets once I was in Flatburg, but only a few. I
>>finally hit a point at an intersection where my
>>destination was clearly in sight in the block to the
>>left. You guessed it: it sent me to the right.
>>
>>Now, my son-in-law has pointed out that the machine
>>may have inadvertently been set to the wrong
>>destination. I don’t think so; I had it set for a
>>destination that was already on the machine and there
>>weren’t a lot of choices.
>>
>>I will say the machine was pretty good about telling
>>me where I was. Telling me how to get where I wanted
>>to go, it was abysmally, hysterically wrong. So, I
>>learned something from that: don’t trust GPS
>>directions. I mean, I knew where I was going, so I
>>knew it was wrong. But what if I didn’t know where I
>>was going?
>>
>>I may be old-fashioned and cantankerous, but I think
>>I’ll stick with paper maps, thank you.
[> [> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
khms
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 02:38:52 11/07/14 Fri

>Premptory!? Darn foiled by automatic spell check
>should be caveat emptor

Don't trust a spell checker, either.
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Jon
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 21:46:10 10/14/14 Tue

>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>
>-- Wes

>
>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>-

>
>Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system.

Yah, some GPS units are pretty bad. A map made with Mapquest and looking on paper/computer before starting out will always get you there.

There's a story around about any number of German drivers following the instructions to the letter and end up submerged in a river. The GPS map showed a bridge over the water where there was none - ever! GPS tries to connect the dots and sends incorrect instructions. The story (more likely a urban legend) says the driver sued the GPS maker for erroneous instructions resulting in a wet car.

Most GPS units have a way to select the type of road or routing to provide. It sounds like your GPS settings are for any road, dirt lane or cowpath.

Most smartphones have a way to provide driving/routing instructions. IIRC, it uses the cell network to gather the lat/long and link that info to a mapping program. The Google Maps version is pretty good. Using smartphone GPS is a way to drain the phone's battery and possibly run up your data charges. As much as I hate to admit it, I was impressed with Google Maps driving directions. Microsoft Streets & Maps is also pretty good but has problems locating a co-ordinate based address such as:
N88W16447 Main St
Menomonee Falls, WI 53051.
where the north cross street 8800 and west 16447 from the Milwaukee 0N-0W location. Most of the north & west outer suburbs of Milwaukee use this system.
[> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
John
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 22:52:28 10/14/14 Tue

However using GPS when you are retired and on a vacation is great. We set ours for the shortest distance which keeps us off the interstates most of the time. You get to see the country that way and the real America. We traveled 5600 miles in September and saw country we had never seen before and probably would not have seen any other way because Samantha [our GPS voice] directed us there. This is a beautiful country but you have to get off the interstates to see it properly. Indiana to Wisconsin to South Dakota to Oregon to New Mexico to Indiana. A long drive but well worth it.
>>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>>
>>-- Wes

>>
>>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>>-

>>
>>Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system.
>
>Yah, some GPS units are pretty bad. A map made with
>Mapquest and looking on paper/computer before starting
>out will always get you there.
>
>There's a story around about any number of German
>drivers following the instructions to the letter and
>end up submerged in a river. The GPS map showed a
>bridge over the water where there was none - ever! GPS
>tries to connect the dots and sends incorrect
>instructions. The story (more likely a urban legend)
>says the driver sued the GPS maker for erroneous
>instructions resulting in a wet car.
>
>Most GPS units have a way to select the type of road
>or routing to provide. It sounds like your GPS
>settings are for any road, dirt lane or cowpath.
>
>Most smartphones have a way to provide driving/routing
>instructions. IIRC, it uses the cell network to gather
>the lat/long and link that info to a mapping program.
>The Google Maps version is pretty good. Using
>smartphone GPS is a way to drain the phone's battery
>and possibly run up your data charges. As much as I
>hate to admit it, I was impressed with Google Maps
>driving directions. Microsoft Streets & Maps is also
>pretty good but has problems locating a co-ordinate
>based address such as:
>N88W16447 Main St
>Menomonee Falls, WI 53051.
>where the north cross street 8800 and west 16447 from
>the Milwaukee 0N-0W location. Most of the north & west
>outer suburbs of Milwaukee use this system.
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Brian Jones
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 03:57:34 10/15/14 Wed

Greetings

SatNavs are wonderful, when they work! Though I've never owned one, gave up driving long distance before they became affordable. I still like good maps, like we have here in Great Britain [England, Wales and Scotland]. For me the advantage of a map is it shows what is around the route you are following.

Years ago in the early days of on-line routing software. I asked for the route from Worcester in England to Wick in the far north of Scotland. The instructions were to head north, in Scotland go to Aberdeen and catch a ferry to Orkney island off the north of Scotland. Then another ferry back to Wick. Completely ignoring the fact there are roads all the way to Wick.

Glad I did not follow the instructions and could have done the journey without really looking at a map.

Brian
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Boyd Percy
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 22:21:35 10/17/14 Fri

>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>
>-- Wes

>
>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>-

>
>Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system. She’s used
>it a little, but I haven’t very much, since I rarely
>drive anywhere these days when I don’t know where I’m
>going because I’ve been there before. Oh, once in a
>while I will go to a race track I’ve never been to
>before and I have to glance at a map, but that’s
>pretty rare.
>
>The other day I had to drive her car up to a town I'll
>call Flatburg. I was by myself, so I thought I’d give
>the GPS a fair trial. Now, I know how to get to
>Flatburg. I’ve known it for fifty years or more, so it
>wasn’t as if I really needed the help. To get to
>Flatburg, you drive north up the highway until you get
>to the interstate, go west, and wait until you get to
>the sign that says “Flatburg.” Very simple. Even a
>child could do it. Right.
>
>I managed to get the thing turned on somewhere north
>of town on the highway. That’s something I don’t
>recommend trying to do while you’re driving by
>yourself, by the way. Almost as soon as I had it on, a
>girl’s voice told me to turn right on a small dirt
>road.
>
>“You’re crazy,” I yelled at the stupid machine. “Why
>would I want to go down a dirt road a mile out of the
>way when where I’m going is right ahead of me on the
>highway?”
>
>So, I ignored it. After I passed the dirt road, in a
>rather snotty voice the machine said, “Recalculating,”
>but in a tone I took to mean, “Why didn’t you listen
>to me the first time, stupid?”
>
>In the next five miles or so it managed to keep from
>sending me down every cross road I passed, but after
>that it didn’t get a thing right. Not once. I would
>have shut the stupid thing off, except I sort of
>wanted to see just how bad it was going to be. The
>answer was “not merely bad, but downright awful.”
>
>The dumb machine tried to send me off course at every
>intersection we came to. Every one! Once it tried to
>send me down a road that was abandoned when I was a
>kid. You might have been able to get down it in a Jeep
>with four-wheel drive and a chainsaw. Another time it
>tried to get me off at an intersection that never
>existed with a road that didn’t cross.
>
>By now, I was laughing at every wrong intersection,
>sometimes shouting things like “You @#$%^&* idiot!” at
>the machine. (Yes, I talk to machines. I’ve always
>done it. Get over it.)
>
>It did get the exit from the interstate at Flatburg
>correct -- but only because the dumb machine had been
>trying to get me off the interstate at every
>intersection from the highway onward. That counts as a
>“little boy who cried wolf” problem. Even that didn’t
>count, since as soon as I was on the side road, it
>tried to get me to go back east on the interstate.
>
>It did miss trying to send me down a few wrong side
>streets once I was in Flatburg, but only a few. I
>finally hit a point at an intersection where my
>destination was clearly in sight in the block to the
>left. You guessed it: it sent me to the right.
>
>Now, my son-in-law has pointed out that the machine
>may have inadvertently been set to the wrong
>destination. I don’t think so; I had it set for a
>destination that was already on the machine and there
>weren’t a lot of choices.
>
>I will say the machine was pretty good about telling
>me where I was. Telling me how to get where I wanted
>to go, it was abysmally, hysterically wrong. So, I
>learned something from that: don’t trust GPS
>directions. I mean, I knew where I was going, so I
>knew it was wrong. But what if I didn’t know where I
>was going?
>
>I may be old-fashioned and cantankerous, but I think
>I’ll stick with paper maps, thank you.


My favorite GPS is the one behind my eyes, between my ears and below the remaining hair on my head. Unfortunately, you need to update the software and hope the device has enough remaining storage space.
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Mike
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 01:20:17 10/18/14 Sat

I have a Garmin 350 that when I first got it did something similar. I updated the maps online and that fixed it. I added a Points Of Interest file that has all the speed camera and red-light camera locations in the state and it's been quite useful.

Finally ... a couple of humorous things that came to mind when reading the above...

This one is a photo of a comic that was posted on the cash register at the hardware store....
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/19778369/recalculating.jpg

And one that was sent to me by a Red Cross radio communications guy...
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/19778369/mapquest-directions-ass.pdf

Mike
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Frank Ryan
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 18:12:13 10/18/14 Sat

All a GPS is, is a very small computer, and I think we all know that if you really want to screw things up ask a computer.

A while ago I found something very cute in "Google Maps" I was in Buffalo NY, and was looking for directions to London Ontario. However I didn't put Ontario into the query. It came back with a route that showed several thousand miles.

I asked for the directions and it wanted me to drive east to Cape Cod, and at the end of cape cod the directions were to "SWIM 1300 MILES EAST'.

I was rather surprised.

They have removed that direction from later versions of the program
[> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Boyd Percy
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 21:15:01 10/18/14 Sat

>All a GPS is, is a very small computer, and I think we
>all know that if you really want to screw things up
>ask a computer.
>
>A while ago I found something very cute in "Google
>Maps" I was in Buffalo NY, and was looking for
>directions to London Ontario. However I didn't put
>Ontario into the query. It came back with a route
>that showed several thousand miles.
>
>I asked for the directions and it wanted me to drive
>east to Cape Cod, and at the end of cape cod the
>directions were to "SWIM 1300 MILES EAST'.
>
>I was rather surprised.
>
>They have removed that direction from later versions
>of the program


I guess the original programer was a real smart ass.
[> [> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Sharon
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 17:17:33 10/21/14 Tue

ACTUAL GPS is a satellite that receives a signal from your "GPS transmitter" and then transmits the location of your transmitter to your computer! "GPS" does NOT give you directions for that you need a NAVIGATION SYSTEM, which usually includes per-programed maps and routing software.

There are also setting within the NAV System where you can tell it to avoid all/certain major highways (freeways, interstates, etc), avoid traffic, avoid toll roads, etc.


>>All a GPS is, is a very small computer, and I think we
>>all know that if you really want to screw things up
>>ask a computer.
>>
>>A while ago I found something very cute in "Google
>>Maps" I was in Buffalo NY, and was looking for
>>directions to London Ontario. However I didn't put
>>Ontario into the query. It came back with a route
>>that showed several thousand miles.
>>
>>I asked for the directions and it wanted me to drive
>>east to Cape Cod, and at the end of cape cod the
>>directions were to "SWIM 1300 MILES EAST'.
>>
>>I was rather surprised.
>>
>>They have removed that direction from later versions
>>of the program
>
>
>I guess the original programer was a real smart ass.
[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Dmitri
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 21:23:53 10/21/14 Tue

The GPS, or Global Positioning System, is actually a whole string of satellites in orbit (24 or more of them?), all of which continuously transmit an individual signal that can be used for positioning by someone with a "GPS receiver."

The "GPS receiver" thingie that you hold in your hand or mount in your vehicle is actually a passive receiver (a real, single-use computer) and doesn't transmit anything at all. It just picks up the continuously transmitted signals from the various satellites and uses them to triangulate and compute where on the earth (or above it) the receiver is located at that specific instant (which continuously updates itself very quickly). It requires a signal from at least three satellites simultaneously to do the locating, but it's more accurate if more than three satellite signals are available.

Sharon is correct that the navigation system is extra software that the GPS receiver manufacturer loads into the receiver they make to give you directions. All the satellites transmit is the signal for the receiver to figure out where it is, and the navigation software you listen to tells you how to get from where the receiver is located at a given instant to the destination location you specify. I'm sure instruction quality varies considerably.

Dmitri

Sharon said:

>ACTUAL GPS is a satellite that receives a signal from
>your "GPS transmitter" and then transmits the location
>of your transmitter to your computer! "GPS" does NOT
>give you directions for that you need a NAVIGATION
>SYSTEM, which usually includes per-programed maps and
>routing software.
>
>There are also setting within the NAV System where you
>can tell it to avoid all/certain major highways
>(freeways, interstates, etc), avoid traffic, avoid
>toll roads, etc.
>
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Buggage
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 02:23:03 10/26/14 Sun

I run a towing company here in the Shenandoah Valley of Va. About once every two weeks or so, I get a call from someone, usually driving a big truck, who has managed to blindly follow their GPS and get stuck onone of our goat paths. The all time best one was last year, when I ended up winching a trailer (loaded of course) off an embankment, and then backing the truck & trailer out, about 2 miles to the hard surfaced road. I love folks who blindly follow the GPS, it's as if they turn the box on, and turn their brain off.

>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>
>-- Wes

>
>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>-

>
>Someone recently gave my wife a GPS system. She’s used
>it a little, but I haven’t very much, since I rarely
>drive anywhere these days when I don’t know where I’m
>going because I’ve been there before. Oh, once in a
>while I will go to a race track I’ve never been to
>before and I have to glance at a map, but that’s
>pretty rare.
>
>The other day I had to drive her car up to a town I'll
>call Flatburg. I was by myself, so I thought I’d give
>the GPS a fair trial. Now, I know how to get to
>Flatburg. I’ve known it for fifty years or more, so it
>wasn’t as if I really needed the help. To get to
>Flatburg, you drive north up the highway until you get
>to the interstate, go west, and wait until you get to
>the sign that says “Flatburg.” Very simple. Even a
>child could do it. Right.
>
>I managed to get the thing turned on somewhere north
>of town on the highway. That’s something I don’t
>recommend trying to do while you’re driving by
>yourself, by the way. Almost as soon as I had it on, a
>girl’s voice told me to turn right on a small dirt
>road.
>
>“You’re crazy,” I yelled at the stupid machine. “Why
>would I want to go down a dirt road a mile out of the
>way when where I’m going is right ahead of me on the
>highway?”
>
>So, I ignored it. After I passed the dirt road, in a
>rather snotty voice the machine said, “Recalculating,”
>but in a tone I took to mean, “Why didn’t you listen
>to me the first time, stupid?”
>
>In the next five miles or so it managed to keep from
>sending me down every cross road I passed, but after
>that it didn’t get a thing right. Not once. I would
>have shut the stupid thing off, except I sort of
>wanted to see just how bad it was going to be. The
>answer was “not merely bad, but downright awful.”
>
>The dumb machine tried to send me off course at every
>intersection we came to. Every one! Once it tried to
>send me down a road that was abandoned when I was a
>kid. You might have been able to get down it in a Jeep
>with four-wheel drive and a chainsaw. Another time it
>tried to get me off at an intersection that never
>existed with a road that didn’t cross.
>
>By now, I was laughing at every wrong intersection,
>sometimes shouting things like “You @#$%^&* idiot!” at
>the machine. (Yes, I talk to machines. I’ve always
>done it. Get over it.)
>
>It did get the exit from the interstate at Flatburg
>correct -- but only because the dumb machine had been
>trying to get me off the interstate at every
>intersection from the highway onward. That counts as a
>“little boy who cried wolf” problem. Even that didn’t
>count, since as soon as I was on the side road, it
>tried to get me to go back east on the interstate.
>
>It did miss trying to send me down a few wrong side
>streets once I was in Flatburg, but only a few. I
>finally hit a point at an intersection where my
>destination was clearly in sight in the block to the
>left. You guessed it: it sent me to the right.
>
>Now, my son-in-law has pointed out that the machine
>may have inadvertently been set to the wrong
>destination. I don’t think so; I had it set for a
>destination that was already on the machine and there
>weren’t a lot of choices.
>
>I will say the machine was pretty good about telling
>me where I was. Telling me how to get where I wanted
>to go, it was abysmally, hysterically wrong. So, I
>learned something from that: don’t trust GPS
>directions. I mean, I knew where I was going, so I
>knew it was wrong. But what if I didn’t know where I
>was going?
>
>I may be old-fashioned and cantankerous, but I think
>I’ll stick with paper maps, thank you.
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Kirby Lambert
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 16:04:01 10/28/14 Tue

I remember back in 2002 I was in New Jersey for the first time. It was after dark and I was going from the Newark airport to Berkley Heights. I had printed maps be fore I left so I was covered. I tried the Hertz Neverlost system just for grins. It showed that I was driving in the river not on the highway. Although I did use the system succesfully over a number of years from that point on I called it Everlost!

Kirby


>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>
>-- Wes

[> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Mikey
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 01:21:48 10/30/14 Thu

>I remember back in 2002 I was in New Jersey for the
>first time. It was after dark and I was going from the
>Newark airport to Berkley Heights. I had printed maps
>before I left so I was covered. I tried the Hertz
>Neverlost system just for grins. It showed that I was
>driving in the river not on the highway. Although I
>did use the system succesfully over a number of years
>from that point on I called it Everlost!
>
>Kirby


You were driving in the river due to a feature called "selective availability" or just "SA".

"Selective availability" was an intentional degradation of public GPS signal accuracy supposedly included in the design for national security reasons.

When switched on, SA allowed the system controllers to offset the displayed location by a selectable amount in a selected direction, usually either east or west.

My first personal experience in using GPS was in a Hertz rental in 1999 or 2000, in the San Francisco Bay area. My passenger said that we were "driving in the weeds" that paralleled the highways.

SA was switched off in September 2007. A friend of mine told me that he was driving on highway 15 between Los Angeles and Las Vegas at the moment when it was actually switched off and the icon representing his car on his Magellan receiver screen "swept" from 500 feet east in the weeds to about 1000 feet west into the desert, then "jumped" to the exact lane he was in and stayed there.

More info:
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~sensing-sensors/readings/GPS_History-MR614.appb.pdf

A bit of history:
My first exposure to what is now called GPS was at an amateur radio club meeting in the mid 1980s, where the speaker was one of the engineers that developed the system (and who was also a licensed ham). The presenter mentioned that there was a poster on the wall of their R&D lab showing the Q-developed locator screen in center console of James Bond's Aston Martin (as shown in the 1964 movie Goldfinger).

A number of photos were shown in the ham radio club presentation. One was of the first usable vehicular receiver - all it displayed was latitude and longitude on a set of numeric displays.

Another of the more interesting photos was of a mobile GPS mapping display receiver demonstration vehicle - a large van with three racks of equipment containing a CRT-based graphics display terminal, it's supporting hardware, a couple of rack-mount disk drives, a minicomputer system to do the GPS location calculations, and an attached external floating point processor to help it do that. The third rack held nothing but satellite radio receivers.

There was a satellite receiving antenna mounted on an attached trailer - and under the antenna was mounted a 15kw 240v generator to power the equipment racks, the disk drives plus the three RV air conditioners (installed in the roof of the van).

The fragility of the disk drives of the day precluded the unit from being used while in motion - any vertical movement, including rough asphalt or even bad tire vibration would crash the disk heads into the spinning platters.

From the time the van came to a stop to the time the operator could generate a location was about 15-20 minutes - assuming the generator actually started, and there were no computer or satellite receiver glitches.

Mike
[> [> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Dmitri
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 09:01:27 10/30/14 Thu

My research indicates that Selective Availability was actually turned off in May of 2000 (the end of Slick Willy Clinton's administration). My own experimentation with it (for wilderness canoeing and hiking) before and after that time period, showed it had settled down a lot during accuracy checks with my own little hand-held unit (not for automobile navigation). I could paddle my canoe away from a beach and then follow a track back and take out on my footprints made when leaving the beach. Before that, I could be as much as a quarter mile off or more (several hundred yards away), though it was often much less than that extreme.

Dmitri

>>I remember back in 2002 I was in New Jersey for the
>>first time. It was after dark and I was going from the
>>Newark airport to Berkley Heights. I had printed maps
>>before I left so I was covered. I tried the Hertz
>>Neverlost system just for grins. It showed that I was
>>driving in the river not on the highway. Although I
>>did use the system succesfully over a number of years
>>from that point on I called it Everlost!
>>
>>Kirby
>
>
>You were driving in the river due to a feature called
>"selective availability" or just "SA".
>
>"Selective availability" was an intentional
>degradation of public GPS signal accuracy supposedly
>included in the design for national security reasons.
>
>When switched on, SA allowed the system controllers to
>offset the displayed location by a selectable amount
>in a selected direction, usually either east or west.
>
>My first personal experience in using GPS was in a
>Hertz rental in 1999 or 2000, in the San Francisco Bay
>area. My passenger said that we were "driving in the
>weeds" that paralleled the highways.
>
>SA was switched off in September 2007. A friend of
>mine told me that he was driving on highway 15 between
>Los Angeles and Las Vegas at the moment when it was
>actually switched off and the icon representing his
>car on his Magellan receiver screen "swept" from 500
>feet east in the weeds to about 1000 feet west into
>the desert, then "jumped" to the exact lane he was in
>and stayed there.
>
>More info:
> >href="http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~sensing-sensors/readings/G
>PS_History-MR614.appb.pdf">http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~sensi
>ng-sensors/readings/GPS_History-MR614.appb.pdf

>
>A bit of history:
>My first exposure to what is now called GPS was at an
>amateur radio club meeting in the mid 1980s, where the
>speaker was one of the engineers that developed the
>system (and who was also a licensed ham). The
>presenter mentioned that there was a poster on the
>wall of their R&D lab showing the Q-developed locator
>screen in center console of James Bond's Aston Martin
>(as shown in the 1964 movie Goldfinger).
>
>A number of photos were shown in the ham radio club
>presentation. One was of the first usable vehicular
>receiver - all it displayed was latitude and longitude
>on a set of numeric displays.
>
>Another of the more interesting photos was of a mobile
>GPS mapping display receiver demonstration vehicle - a
>large van with three racks of equipment containing a
>CRT-based graphics display terminal, it's supporting
>hardware, a couple of rack-mount disk drives, a
>minicomputer system to do the GPS location
>calculations, and an attached external floating point
>processor to help it do that. The third rack held
>nothing but satellite radio receivers.
>
>There was a satellite receiving antenna mounted on an
>attached trailer - and under the antenna was mounted a
>15kw 240v generator to power the equipment racks, the
>disk drives plus the three RV air conditioners
>(installed in the roof of the van).
>
>The fragility of the disk drives of the day precluded
>the unit from being used while in motion - any
>vertical movement, including rough asphalt or even bad
>tire vibration would crash the disk heads into the
>spinning platters.
>
>From the time the van came to a stop to the time the
>operator could generate a location was about 15-20
>minutes - assuming the generator actually started, and
>there were no computer or satellite receiver glitches.
>
>Mike
[> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
IanS
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 17:01:55 11/03/14 Mon

A group of then diving enthusiasts we combined to buy an early GPS receiver that had an interface port. Whilst tied up in port we connected it to a plotter and the plotter plotted a near perfect circle with random dots with our actual position at the centre.
As we normally set off from the same location we found that when the USA had problems abroad SA was switched off our position was correct. Presumably it was switched off so that its forces could use many cheep commercial sets instead of the few milspec sets in high value vehicals.

>I remember back in 2002 I was in New Jersey for the
>first time. It was after dark and I was going from the
>Newark airport to Berkley Heights. I had printed maps
>be fore I left so I was covered. I tried the Hertz
>Neverlost system just for grins. It showed that I was
>driving in the river not on the highway. Although I
>did use the system succesfully over a number of years
>from that point on I called it Everlost!
>
>Kirby
>
>
>>Another column picked up from the paper. I've
>>touched it up to de-emphasize the local angle a
>>little, but other than that it's absolutely true.
>>
>>-- Wes

[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Andrew
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 11:33:31 11/01/14 Sat

It sounds very much as though that particular device was set up for someone on foot, that would explain most of the poor decisions it wanted to make.

I don't have one at present but had two over seven years until this summer. One would take me several hundred metres (and three lights) out of my way to reduce the distance I drove in a residential area by 50 metres, the second also had some pretty weird ideas at times. I routinely ignored them if I thought I knew better, of course some times they were right and I was wrong.
[> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Allen McIntosh
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 20:06:28 11/03/14 Mon

>I may be old-fashioned and cantankerous, but I think
>I’ll stick with paper maps, thank you.

That works unless you get caught by one of the "errors" that mapmakers supposedly used to add to help them catch copyright violators.

There could also have been errors in the database of street segments. The database usually only contains the numbers at the ends of each segment, and the rest happens by interpolation. If the numbers are wrong or the geometry is wrong, ridiculous things can happen.
[> [> Subject: Re: Recalculating . . .


Author:
Brian Jones
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 17:43:51 11/06/14 Thu

Greetings

Here in Great Britain all the road maps are accurate. All generated by Ordnance Survey. However, street maps were often done by commercial publishers and they did add one or two 'features' to see if other publishers copied their maps.

Many years ago I had a friend working for the Ordnance Survey, who made the observation to map tracks through wooded areas it had to be done with paper and pencil on the ground.

http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/

Brian


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