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Subject: Re: Grand Canyon raft trips shutdown


Author:
Dmitri
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Date Posted: 21:09:24 10/20/13 Sun
In reply to: Jack 's message, "Re: Grand Canyon raft trips shutdown" on 00:09:59 10/04/13 Fri

I just got back from almost a month in Utah all of which (so far) included the national parks closure period.

I was supposed to do a run on the Green River (a headwaters feeder stream to the Colorado flowing into it above Lake Powell) through Canyonlands National Park starting two days after the Federal shutdown began.

Before that run I did a 7-day 4WD trip in the park and came out on the day the Feds shut down and I was notified that I wouldn't be able to do the river run unless the Feds approved a budget in time. It obviously didn't happen. We found out just a couple days later that we'd be getting a refund of our permit fees. I'm pretty sure that the people in the story below will also get refunds, but not for all the other expenses involved, some of which are even greater than the permit fees. Our river permit expenses were cheap in comparison, about $70, if I remember right. The thousand mile drive to Utah and then the same back home after that cost quite a bit more.

I also had an alternate river to run, just did the section of the Green River down to where I was supposed to put in, using it as a takeout rather than a put in. The section isn't as nice but is still quite similar. The people in the story below didn't have that option.

Utah has I think 5 national parks and lots more national monuments, and much of the area is totally dependent on tourist income from park visitation. I think they were the first to do state funding of the parks (though not all the national monuments) for a 10-day period while the feds got over their squabbles. Arizona did the same for the Grand Canyon, and I think a few other states also followed suit. Unfortunately, it didn't help those who were scheduled to run before the parks reopened -- like me, the people in the story, and many others. I had a very apologetic offer on the phone message machine and in e-mail when I got back home letting me know that I'd be able to reschedule the trip if I want to or get a permit fee refund instead, and I'm sure that the people in the story below probably got that same offer also. Of course, it still doesn't make up for all those other expenses mentioned. But they'll probably get to go soon if they want to. I plan to reschedule for my Green River run, but then I've already done that same exact stretch numerous times already, so it's not as big of a deal to me.

This is not the Park Service's fault, certainly not the employees who have to follow the rules and disallow us entry. They were off work unpaid and most (if any) couldn't collect unemployment for that time, either.

It's just one problem with our "perfect" political system. I plan to do what I can to impeach or recall every last one of my congressmen, senators and house of reps, because of this. They (the fat cats) didn't have any repercussions from this at all other than invective, which is easy for them to ignore. It was a problem only for citizens who elected them, as well as visitors to our country wanting to spend money while here. I don't yet know what I can do to possibly initiate the process of replacing them all, suggestions are welcome.

Dmitri


>Our tax dollars at work...NOT ! Congress has stopped a
>lot of us from enjoying the national parks. My family
>will be going to Tennessee next week. The trip has
>been planed for months. The grand kids were looking
>forward to seeing the Great Smoky Mountains National
>Park hopefully congress will work to fund the
>government by then.
>

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Replies:
[> [> [> Subject: Re: Grand Canyon raft trips shutdown


Author:
Leo
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Date Posted: 21:27:54 10/20/13 Sun

I know what you mean; I'm a great deal closer to "ground zero," in that I work in a Museum on the National Mall, a little closer to the White House than to the Capital. We were down for eighteen days, and even on a "quiet" time like now, we still typically get about 2000 people through the doors, which sounds like 36,000 people just to my building alone.

Unfortunately, it seems like anything useful (read: radical!) would involve something being passed through Congress. I seem to recall it being a pretty ugly thing to try to get a Constitutional Amendment through starting from the States; even worse than trying to get one through by starting it in Congress.

Leo
[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Grand Canyon raft trips shutdown


Author:
Dmitri
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 11:19:20 10/23/13 Wed

Leo,

I think it could be done through individual local "grass-roots" recall efforts rather than an all-inclusive "en-mass" attempt, but it would have to be a significant portion of congress critters that it happens to to be very effective. There would be publicity even if just one or two recall events were initiated, especially if successful, but the change of just a few house and/or senate members wouldn't help much in telling the rest that they're not at all serving their constituents' interests with their shenanigans. It takes a mass replacement of a significant number of them to do that and possibly scare the rest into line. Some coordination would possibly help, but organization efforts that are not my strong suit. We need Emily Holst to start it.

>I know what you mean; I'm a great deal closer to
>"ground zero," in that I work in a Museum on the
>National Mall, a little closer to the White House than
>to the Capital. We were down for eighteen days, and
>even on a "quiet" time like now, we still typically
>get about 2000 people through the doors, which sounds
>like 36,000 people just to my building alone.
>
>Unfortunately, it seems like anything useful (read:
>radical!) would involve something being passed through
>Congress. I seem to recall it being a pretty ugly
>thing to try to get a Constitutional Amendment through
>starting from the States; even worse than trying to
>get one through by starting it in Congress.
>
>Leo


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