This whole thing reminds me of Roseanne as well. She still miraculously has her job at the police station, but they showed her there one day, totally failing, and needing to get in with RJ in order to get by because she couldn't possibly do that just working for an honest living. -- At The Bayberry

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Date Posted: 15:13:33 03/09/01 Fri
Author: Elisa
Subject: This whole thing reminds me of Roseanne as well. She still miraculously has her job at the police station, but they showed her there one day, totally failing, and needing to get in with RJ in order to get by because she couldn't possibly do that just working for an honest living.
In reply to: TROG42 's message, "Daytime and Feminism!!!" on 13:23:34 03/09/01 Fri

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Trog42, MY main problem w/females under Jillyfication was ALL female were written w/same UGLY traits, lying & betraying others. Viki, Jess & Renee, previously good strong women w/integrity, lied & betrayed those they loved & were suddenly weak & clingy standing �by their man� at any cost to family & friends! Frankly, I couldn�t tell the �bitches� from the �heroines� & that is disturbing trend I see, no females left to admire as ALL are degrading examples of womenhood! (NT) -- Pilar, 15:49:49 03/09/01 Fri

2) I can�t lump Tea w/Nora & Viki. Tea wasn�t saint prior to victimization & virginalization, that is. Tea used brains & sheer gall to get what she wanted, not above a scheme herself. ITA, she had worked HARD to build a career for herself yet, w/Javier & Kevin she proved NOT above using her body to get what she wanted when all else failed. That�s why Todd Manning rocked her world, he refused to be manipulated like that & pointed out she was shortchanging herself too much! (NT) -- Pilar, 15:53:19 03/09/01 Fri

3) ITA, dignity is sadly lacking in females in daytime, Blair�s crawling on knees begging Max to take her back made me puke. Lindsay doing same for months on end w/Bo ditto. Worse of all FEMALES were writing these DEGRADING scenes for females! Christ, how it bothers me a man like Malone had MORE respect for women than many of these female writers show!! (NT) -- Pilar, 15:54:06 03/09/01 Fri
- 4) IMO Carly is NO Blair clone, she�s NOT that shallow! SB portrayed Carly as a damaged, vulnerable & distrustful woman w/many layers, more like a Todd, a survivor at all costs, can�t be broken & rarely bends. And like Todd, Carly repeatedly self-destructs due her own warped thinking. Carly wasn�t redeemed by motherhood for she abandoned her child. No, Carly�s redeeming qualities are she�s got solid steel in her veins & would take a bullet for those she loves completely, Sonny, Jase or Michael! (NT) -- Pilar, 15:56:49 03/09/01 Fri
  - 5) Lastly, sad fact on daytime, there is often NO justice, poetic or otherwise, delivered to females that lie/cheat/steal/betray their way through life. But then that�s often true for male characters, too. Malone�s early work is often termed �morality plays� b/c good always ended up triumphing over bad, including the �good� within a �bad� character like Todd! (NT) -- Pilar, 15:59:07 03/09/01 Fri
    - Pilar I have to agrre with you about Carly. When she first apperared on the show she really bothered me. However, over the years I have grown to really like her. Yes, she's screwed up but when she falls she does try and pick herself back up again. She's not the perfect parent and she knows this. Yes, she goes after those she dosen't like with a vengence but...those she loves she protects with all her being. (NT) -- jinx, 21:32:45 03/09/01 Fri
      - Hi Jinx, Carly fascinated me from the start, probably due to SB's talents sparking my interest but Carly is tough character to like I get that, much like Todd I find most either LOVE or LOATHE this type of character. ITA, Carly�s proven a lioness protecting her loved ones many a time, I admire the commitment if not her methods sometimes, ;-) (NT) -- Pilar, 05:56:51 03/10/01 Sat
- Pilar... it IS amazing that MALE writers seem to reflect more respect for female characters than female writers/EPs.. for ex, ATWT's new HW is a man and (imo) the depiction of females on THAT show is NOT as bad as on some others I watch! I think ABC Daytime is, by far, worst offender... (NT) -- jackie, 16:35:46 03/09/01 Fri
  - Guza was often labeled a misogynist for his female characterizations yet he created Alexis & Carly, both incredibly strong woman, in their own diverse ways. (NT) -- Pilar, 16:53:12 03/09/01 Fri
  - What amazes me, too, is that the same female EP's and writers just continue to work their way through daytime and savage the female characters. Probably the worst act of violence against women in terms of graphic nature was on AW- EP'd by Charlotte Savitz (aka Charlotte the Savage) and written by Maggie DePriest. I still have the image of Frankie Frame in my head as she struggled for her life. (NT) -- Nic, 19:39:25 03/09/01 Fri