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• Your story about Fr. Finlay and the school papers was pretty much repeated at WFUV through the late '80s as well. Only heard from the "pros" when something went wrong or they wanted something. (NT) -- Ram '91, Tue March 15, 2005 09:36:00

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• We managed to deliver a professional quality newspaper twice a week in the early seventies without a teacher looking over our shoulders. Secondly, we didn't need a spell check. (NT) -- GMeagherFC74, Tue March 15, 2005 09:51:34
  • In the mid-70's, the issues had fewer pages, and you had larger staffs. Also, our publications in the mid-1980s were high quality. When I worked on the paper, we routinely won scholastic press awards, including first place in the Columbia Scholastic Press Association contest three straight years. But the point is we could have been better. There's always a way to improve. (NT) -- JoltinJoe, Tue March 15, 2005 10:10:47
    • Joe: The issues you raise are constants in the world of student journalism. These are students -- very raw at what they do. I suspect there are even fewer high school papers nowadays than there were 30 years ago, so even fewer kids have ever done journalism before getting to The Ram or FUV. The Ram was for years a nearly self-sustaining entity economically (is it still?). Thus, we could argue that we should not have an official adviser. I'm sure, after years in the news business, that that was not such a good thing. But I don't know how much the kids want to hear that. There is no doubt that the paper would be better with professional guidance. But students historically have felt that would "censor" them. If only they knew how real newspapers operate, they might not mind. Believe me, the problem here is not technology. (NT) -- RC74, Tue March 15, 2005 10:43:54

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• The criticisms about The Ram's technology is still a valid one today. The support for The Ram needs to be improved. There are often problems with the company that prints and delivers the paper as well. (NT) -- Worried RAM, Tue March 15, 2005 10:21:27

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• Here's an idea that I'd like your opinions on. Making The Ram an independent corporation and moving it off campus, just like the Harvard Crimson does. There would be drawbacks such as less funding from Fordham, but it might also encourage more independence, professionalism and focus on broader community (similar to FUV). Okay, fire away. (NT) -- DamnRam, Tue March 15, 2005 10:35:27

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• I'm going to agree with you, then disagree, JoltinJoe. I have to believe my Ram articles and those of my contemporaries in the late 70s were more professionally reported, written and composed than what I've read in that paper over the past 10 years. I don't think it's just vanity or nostalgia; I think our product was a good one back then. However, I think what appears in the Ram now pretty much mirrors other college papers. Over the past 10 years, the entry-level people I've hired show pretty miserable writing skills, even though most were journalism majors and had some experience. My point is that the problem is not specific to the Ram -- not that that makes it OK. (NT) -- 70sRam, Tue March 15, 2005 10:38:11
  • I know how good The Ram was in your era. We frequently used The Ram for research when preparing stories and features for the paper, and the 1970s Rams were a pleasure to read. But I also know what enormous time commitments were necessary to put out a first-rate paper at Fordham, given the substandard technology we (and you) faced. We lost time from class and from study. I only brought this up because I suspect that Mr. Cataldo was faced with severe time constraints when he wrote his article. Given time to reflect, he might have written something better. His article was poor, true, but I thought it was important for those of you who are so critical of this young man to understand how the severe time constraints imposed on our student editors can affect their judgment. (NT) -- JoltinJoe, Tue March 15, 2005 14:35:04
    • Joe, the whole point of learning journalism is learning to think and write coherently under time constraints. That IS the job! Technology doesn't solve those time constraints; in fact, in some ways, it has made them worse. The kid wrote a poorly thought out, un sophisticated, unfair piece. Like others above, I don't want him fired. Indeed, whoever was supposed to edit him is who should be on the hot seat. But please don't make excuses about time or technology. (NT) -- rc74, Tue March 15, 2005 22:51:55
      • I'm not making excuses. I'm just offering an explanation for the benefit of those who never worked on a Fordham publication. Sure, a professional journalist or editor works under time constraints. But the time constraints faced by a student can be worse, resulting from limited technology which forces the students to spend more time on a task than a professional might. I disagree about technology. Used properly, it is always a great asset. In this regard, I'm not just talking about copy features, like spell check. I'm talking about technological featues that assist in layout. I offer no excuse. The article should not have run. On the other hand, the criticism of this student has been way too extreme, so I tendered an explanation based on my experience at Fordham. (NT) -- JoltinJoe, Wed March 16, 2005 06:22:16

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• As an example, I worked as a reporter and sports editor for the Jamesonian at Bishop Loughlin Memorial High School. Then in the summer before my senior year the good Christian Brothers sent me to a month-long journalism training course at Catholic University of America before I became Editor-in-Chief . So in my day, students were trained in high school. One of my fellow editors at Loughlin, Steve Zipay covers sports media for Long Island's Newsday. (NT) -- GMeagher FC74, Tue March 15, 2005 11:47:20
  • Exactly. My high school paper still sends the staff of editors to a conference at least once a year. So, the opportunities are still out there. And I refuse to believe that there are fewer high school papers because newspapers require advanced technology to publish. The technology gap in virtually every creative field from filmmaking to web design continues to narrow as time goes on. (If there is a reason for the backslide in "amateur" newspaper quality or participation, I'd chalk it up to a decline in the popularity of traditional print media, thanks to the advent of the Internet as a news provider.) The reality is that all a HS paper needs to put together a top-notch product is a program like PageMaker or InDesign, a good printshop who will work with them, and students dedicated enough to learn the ins and outs of the newspaper business, even if it means researching industry standards on their own. (NT) -- RamRunner12, Tue March 15, 2005 12:32:37

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• The Ram -- PhotoEditor81, Tue March 15, 2005 20:27:48
  • Oh those days of laying out the paper. The typist coming in, completely wasted, to fill in the columns and then manually pasting the whole issue up, and driving it to the printer (usually after Wine & cheese at the Ramskeller- problem was they only served beer.) On a serious note, I saw EofC like Jim Dwyer, Neil Greely at work. They knew how to use the english language, report great stories and teach the staff. Today's kid's rely on spell check, and have much poorer writing skills. I have had many occasions to choke when training recent grads in financial analysis. Using proper english was a challenge to many.... (NT) -- Photoeditor81, Tue March 15, 2005 20:29:28