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Subject: BEFORE I POST ABOUT THE ACTUAL COMPETITION OR WHATEVER IT WAS CALLED

Author:
Owner/Moderator

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 14:14:21 12/21/19 Sat

I just want to comment on the pure chaos that has happened after the pageant. First of all, Katelynne Cox came out and said that she was silenced by NBC and the MAO. The pageant happened 24 hours after the third time in our nation's history where a president has been impeached. There was a primary debate happening at the same time. But what she said was quite newsworthy and had it not happened during that time, I think it would have been the story that hit the news. It still might. I read Marilyn VanDerbur's book, and she talked about how she was coming out as a childhood sexual abuse survivor around the time she was asked to judge. She told NBC that she would only judge if she was announced as a sexual abuse survivor. From what I remember, they didn't initially feel comfortable with it, but she was insistent. And she was able to judge and be announced as a sexual abuse survivor. That was either 1990 or 1991. How shameful that we went backwards 30 years later. And how shameful and hypocritical of the MAO for saying that this is supposed to be about social impacts and then saying it's too much. There are MANY brave contestants who shared their story about being sexually violated over the years and surviving it. Mallory's platform was regarding childhood sexual abuse. MAO, YOU created these rules that a contestant needed to show a commitment to a specific platform. And then when someone wants to take on something uncomfortable, you want them to shut up? I do hope that Katelynne has a chance to speak out in the media and confront this. And I hope this story does not disappear. As far as NBC, they kept their own predator on the air for several years until finally women came forward and forced them to do something about it. They have no moral high ground here, but I'm not surprised. I know there is a camp out there who thinks Sam Haskell would have been better right now. I say no, because when you demean women, it's the same thing as NBC and the current MAO did to Katelynne. Same thing, there's no difference.

And there is the other problem. Supposedly, Texas wanted to leave this week. Oregon, the preliminary interview winner, called for transparency. I think that something went seriously wrong during pageant week. Last year, titleholders like Christine Williamson and Annie Jorgensen came forward and talked about their experiences. I highly doubt it has been easier on this year's contestants. During the "orientation", it was reported that the contestants were told they had to tow the line or else. I think they were intimidated into what we saw this week. There seems to be at least some thought that this was pre-determined for Camille to win. I think there might have been a push to pick a certain "type" of winner. I am listening to Betty and Savvy as they are talking, and they are concerned that this has become an academic competition. It's always been that you attract academic types and had someone like Erika Harold win. But I also strongly agree that it seems like with these changes that you have to be a certain kind of woman. Now, I do think that Camille is very pretty and she looks like what you think a Miss America should look like. Some people felt that she pandered to win. I don't know what to think. I do have a different theory. Last year during Nia's interview, she said that she brought in sponsors. During the post crowning conference, Camille said that she was approached by corporate sponsors. Is this part of the "judging" factor now-how much the contestant can bring in? But then again, how the hell can they keep sponsors right now and keep them happy? They all jumped ship with the Haskell scandal and NOBODY came on with these so-called changes. There is no proper management. Camille can probably align with large multi-million dollar pharmaceutical companies whereas Georgia would have aligned with children who are so poor their foster families can get public assistance for them. There was no money in her platform. I HOPE I am wrong.

And then there was the issue of asking about children and being married. I think it is completely acceptable to be in a relationship and be Miss America. Now as far as being married or divorced and being Miss America. The reality is that most young people are delaying marriage to their late 20s and early 30s at least as well as child-rearing. That is our society. If you happen to get married young under the age of 25 (the current MAO limit) or before, it's not the norm. If you are on the road for 300 days a year, how can you grow your young marriage? And how could you justify leaving a small child alone for a year and more? If you are competing for a state pageant, you are still very busy. This isn't the job for a parent or young wife. And if you happen to be under 25 and divorced, that's a rough ride of it. I had a few friends who married that young, it was a mistake for them, and they were devastated that their lives were affected by divorce at such a young age. You think they want to turn around and do a pageant to get over the devastation of the death of a marriage? Some of these things just do not make sense. I know both GA and VA took some slack for their answers, but I don't think it's realistic to be Miss America and be a mother to a small child. And I don't think it's healthy to have a young marriage and expect to grow it properly. Ask anyone and they will tell you the first few years of marriage are the hardest. It's not about whether you support women or not, it's more about growing a healthy marriage. You can do both. I don't think it is wrong to consider the emotional effects of having an absentee mother, which is what you would be if you were off traveling the country when your child is very young.

It looks like we are right back where we started from before this nonsense, and now it did have a national stage for a night. NOBODY likes these changes, and that has to be addressed. My wild and crazy traveling companion said this-we would possibly go to a 100th anniversary Miss America pageant or whatever. But after that, we will not be going if it is like this. They touted that they were online now during the preliminary nights. I saw my first online pageant in 2002, Miss Ohio. And I had dialup still. This is not groundbreaking. But it's not worth it to have the non-contestants there for two days in the winter with bad travel and nothing to do otherwise. And two nights of essentially speaking with a little bit of talent thrown in is not worth it.

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Replies:

[> Subject: Camille said during her onstage Q&A that should would legislate against the pharmaceutical companies to help fight the opioid crisis. It would contradict her stand if she accepted sponsorship from drug manufacturers.

Author:
No name
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 19:44:32 12/21/19 Sat

>I just want to comment on the pure chaos that has
>happened after the pageant. First of all, Katelynne
>Cox came out and said that she was silenced by NBC and
>the MAO. The pageant happened 24 hours after the
>third time in our nation's history where a president
>has been impeached. There was a primary debate
>happening at the same time. But what she said was
>quite newsworthy and had it not happened during that
>time, I think it would have been the story that hit
>the news. It still might. I read Marilyn VanDerbur's
>book, and she talked about how she was coming out as a
>childhood sexual abuse survivor around the time she
>was asked to judge. She told NBC that she would only
>judge if she was announced as a sexual abuse survivor.
> From what I remember, they didn't initially feel
>comfortable with it, but she was insistent. And she
>was able to judge and be announced as a sexual abuse
>survivor. That was either 1990 or 1991. How shameful
>that we went backwards 30 years later. And how
>shameful and hypocritical of the MAO for saying that
>this is supposed to be about social impacts and then
>saying it's too much. There are MANY brave
>contestants who shared their story about being
>sexually violated over the years and surviving it.
>Mallory's platform was regarding childhood sexual
>abuse. MAO, YOU created these rules that a contestant
>needed to show a commitment to a specific platform.
>And then when someone wants to take on something
>uncomfortable, you want them to shut up? I do hope
>that Katelynne has a chance to speak out in the media
>and confront this. And I hope this story does not
>disappear. As far as NBC, they kept their own predator
>on the air for several years until finally women came
>forward and forced them to do something about it.
>They have no moral high ground here, but I'm not
>surprised. I know there is a camp out there who
>thinks Sam Haskell would have been better right now.
>I say no, because when you demean women, it's the same
>thing as NBC and the current MAO did to Katelynne.
>Same thing, there's no difference.
>
>And there is the other problem. Supposedly, Texas
>wanted to leave this week. Oregon, the preliminary
>interview winner, called for transparency. I think
>that something went seriously wrong during pageant
>week. Last year, titleholders like Christine
>Williamson and Annie Jorgensen came forward and talked
>about their experiences. I highly doubt it has been
>easier on this year's contestants. During the
>"orientation", it was reported that the contestants
>were told they had to tow the line or else. I think
>they were intimidated into what we saw this week.
>There seems to be at least some thought that this was
>pre-determined for Camille to win. I think there
>might have been a push to pick a certain "type" of
>winner. I am listening to Betty and Savvy as they are
>talking, and they are concerned that this has become
>an academic competition. It's always been that you
>attract academic types and had someone like Erika
>Harold win. But I also strongly agree that it seems
>like with these changes that you have to be a certain
>kind of woman. Now, I do think that Camille is very
>pretty and she looks like what you think a Miss
>America should look like. Some people felt that she
>pandered to win. I don't know what to think. I do
>have a different theory. Last year during Nia's
>interview, she said that she brought in sponsors.
>During the post crowning conference, Camille said that
>she was approached by corporate sponsors. Is this
>part of the "judging" factor now-how much the
>contestant can bring in? But then again, how the hell
>can they keep sponsors right now and keep them happy?
>They all jumped ship with the Haskell scandal and
>NOBODY came on with these so-called changes. There is
>no proper management. Camille can probably align with
>large multi-million dollar pharmaceutical companies
>whereas Georgia would have aligned with children who
>are so poor their foster families can get public
>assistance for them. There was no money in her
>platform. I HOPE I am wrong.
>
>And then there was the issue of asking about children
>and being married. I think it is completely
>acceptable to be in a relationship and be Miss
>America. Now as far as being married or divorced and
>being Miss America. The reality is that most young
>people are delaying marriage to their late 20s and
>early 30s at least as well as child-rearing. That is
>our society. If you happen to get married young under
>the age of 25 (the current MAO limit) or before, it's
>not the norm. If you are on the road for 300 days a
>year, how can you grow your young marriage? And how
>could you justify leaving a small child alone for a
>year and more? If you are competing for a state
>pageant, you are still very busy. This isn't the job
>for a parent or young wife. And if you happen to be
>under 25 and divorced, that's a rough ride of it. I
>had a few friends who married that young, it was a
>mistake for them, and they were devastated that their
>lives were affected by divorce at such a young age.
>You think they want to turn around and do a pageant to
>get over the devastation of the death of a marriage?
>Some of these things just do not make sense. I know
>both GA and VA took some slack for their answers, but
>I don't think it's realistic to be Miss America and be
>a mother to a small child. And I don't think it's
>healthy to have a young marriage and expect to grow it
>properly. Ask anyone and they will tell you the first
>few years of marriage are the hardest. It's not about
>whether you support women or not, it's more about
>growing a healthy marriage. You can do both. I don't
>think it is wrong to consider the emotional effects of
>having an absentee mother, which is what you would be
>if you were off traveling the country when your child
>is very young.
>
>It looks like we are right back where we started from
>before this nonsense, and now it did have a national
>stage for a night. NOBODY likes these changes, and
>that has to be addressed. My wild and crazy traveling
>companion said this-we would possibly go to a 100th
>anniversary Miss America pageant or whatever. But
>after that, we will not be going if it is like this.
>They touted that they were online now during the
>preliminary nights. I saw my first online pageant in
>2002, Miss Ohio. And I had dialup still. This is not
>groundbreaking. But it's not worth it to have the
>non-contestants there for two days in the winter with
>bad travel and nothing to do otherwise. And two
>nights of essentially speaking with a little bit of
>talent thrown in is not worth it.

[> [> Subject: I am confused. I thought the same thing, but she spoke in her post win conference about working for drug safety. I would think right now that with the opiod crisis being at such an awareness, she will have a chance to align herself with some good organizations. Of course, there are the feelgood things that the drug companies put out to make it seem as if they are working to combat the issue.

Author:
Owner/Moderator
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 12:54:10 12/22/19 Sun

>>I just want to comment on the pure chaos that has
>>happened after the pageant. First of all, Katelynne
>>Cox came out and said that she was silenced by NBC and
>>the MAO. The pageant happened 24 hours after the
>>third time in our nation's history where a president
>>has been impeached. There was a primary debate
>>happening at the same time. But what she said was
>>quite newsworthy and had it not happened during that
>>time, I think it would have been the story that hit
>>the news. It still might. I read Marilyn VanDerbur's
>>book, and she talked about how she was coming out as a
>>childhood sexual abuse survivor around the time she
>>was asked to judge. She told NBC that she would only
>>judge if she was announced as a sexual abuse survivor.
>> From what I remember, they didn't initially feel
>>comfortable with it, but she was insistent. And she
>>was able to judge and be announced as a sexual abuse
>>survivor. That was either 1990 or 1991. How shameful
>>that we went backwards 30 years later. And how
>>shameful and hypocritical of the MAO for saying that
>>this is supposed to be about social impacts and then
>>saying it's too much. There are MANY brave
>>contestants who shared their story about being
>>sexually violated over the years and surviving it.
>>Mallory's platform was regarding childhood sexual
>>abuse. MAO, YOU created these rules that a contestant
>>needed to show a commitment to a specific platform.
>>And then when someone wants to take on something
>>uncomfortable, you want them to shut up? I do hope
>>that Katelynne has a chance to speak out in the media
>>and confront this. And I hope this story does not
>>disappear. As far as NBC, they kept their own predator
>>on the air for several years until finally women came
>>forward and forced them to do something about it.
>>They have no moral high ground here, but I'm not
>>surprised. I know there is a camp out there who
>>thinks Sam Haskell would have been better right now.
>>I say no, because when you demean women, it's the same
>>thing as NBC and the current MAO did to Katelynne.
>>Same thing, there's no difference.
>>
>>And there is the other problem. Supposedly, Texas
>>wanted to leave this week. Oregon, the preliminary
>>interview winner, called for transparency. I think
>>that something went seriously wrong during pageant
>>week. Last year, titleholders like Christine
>>Williamson and Annie Jorgensen came forward and talked
>>about their experiences. I highly doubt it has been
>>easier on this year's contestants. During the
>>"orientation", it was reported that the contestants
>>were told they had to tow the line or else. I think
>>they were intimidated into what we saw this week.
>>There seems to be at least some thought that this was
>>pre-determined for Camille to win. I think there
>>might have been a push to pick a certain "type" of
>>winner. I am listening to Betty and Savvy as they are
>>talking, and they are concerned that this has become
>>an academic competition. It's always been that you
>>attract academic types and had someone like Erika
>>Harold win. But I also strongly agree that it seems
>>like with these changes that you have to be a certain
>>kind of woman. Now, I do think that Camille is very
>>pretty and she looks like what you think a Miss
>>America should look like. Some people felt that she
>>pandered to win. I don't know what to think. I do
>>have a different theory. Last year during Nia's
>>interview, she said that she brought in sponsors.
>>During the post crowning conference, Camille said that
>>she was approached by corporate sponsors. Is this
>>part of the "judging" factor now-how much the
>>contestant can bring in? But then again, how the hell
>>can they keep sponsors right now and keep them happy?
>>They all jumped ship with the Haskell scandal and
>>NOBODY came on with these so-called changes. There is
>>no proper management. Camille can probably align with
>>large multi-million dollar pharmaceutical companies
>>whereas Georgia would have aligned with children who
>>are so poor their foster families can get public
>>assistance for them. There was no money in her
>>platform. I HOPE I am wrong.
>>
>>And then there was the issue of asking about children
>>and being married. I think it is completely
>>acceptable to be in a relationship and be Miss
>>America. Now as far as being married or divorced and
>>being Miss America. The reality is that most young
>>people are delaying marriage to their late 20s and
>>early 30s at least as well as child-rearing. That is
>>our society. If you happen to get married young under
>>the age of 25 (the current MAO limit) or before, it's
>>not the norm. If you are on the road for 300 days a
>>year, how can you grow your young marriage? And how
>>could you justify leaving a small child alone for a
>>year and more? If you are competing for a state
>>pageant, you are still very busy. This isn't the job
>>for a parent or young wife. And if you happen to be
>>under 25 and divorced, that's a rough ride of it. I
>>had a few friends who married that young, it was a
>>mistake for them, and they were devastated that their
>>lives were affected by divorce at such a young age.
>>You think they want to turn around and do a pageant to
>>get over the devastation of the death of a marriage?
>>Some of these things just do not make sense. I know
>>both GA and VA took some slack for their answers, but
>>I don't think it's realistic to be Miss America and be
>>a mother to a small child. And I don't think it's
>>healthy to have a young marriage and expect to grow it
>>properly. Ask anyone and they will tell you the first
>>few years of marriage are the hardest. It's not about
>>whether you support women or not, it's more about
>>growing a healthy marriage. You can do both. I don't
>>think it is wrong to consider the emotional effects of
>>having an absentee mother, which is what you would be
>>if you were off traveling the country when your child
>>is very young.
>>
>>It looks like we are right back where we started from
>>before this nonsense, and now it did have a national
>>stage for a night. NOBODY likes these changes, and
>>that has to be addressed. My wild and crazy traveling
>>companion said this-we would possibly go to a 100th
>>anniversary Miss America pageant or whatever. But
>>after that, we will not be going if it is like this.
>>They touted that they were online now during the
>>preliminary nights. I saw my first online pageant in
>>2002, Miss Ohio. And I had dialup still. This is not
>>groundbreaking. But it's not worth it to have the
>>non-contestants there for two days in the winter with
>>bad travel and nothing to do otherwise. And two
>>nights of essentially speaking with a little bit of
>>talent thrown in is not worth it.

[> [> [> Subject: I can see the Sacklers or Purdue Pharma having the money and desperation to hire her.

Author:
No name
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 13:20:56 12/22/19 Sun

>>>I just want to comment on the pure chaos that has
>>>happened after the pageant. First of all, Katelynne
>>>Cox came out and said that she was silenced by NBC
>and
>>>the MAO. The pageant happened 24 hours after the
>>>third time in our nation's history where a president
>>>has been impeached. There was a primary debate
>>>happening at the same time. But what she said was
>>>quite newsworthy and had it not happened during that
>>>time, I think it would have been the story that hit
>>>the news. It still might. I read Marilyn
>VanDerbur's
>>>book, and she talked about how she was coming out as
>a
>>>childhood sexual abuse survivor around the time she
>>>was asked to judge. She told NBC that she would only
>>>judge if she was announced as a sexual abuse
>survivor.
>>> From what I remember, they didn't initially feel
>>>comfortable with it, but she was insistent. And she
>>>was able to judge and be announced as a sexual abuse
>>>survivor. That was either 1990 or 1991. How
>shameful
>>>that we went backwards 30 years later. And how
>>>shameful and hypocritical of the MAO for saying that
>>>this is supposed to be about social impacts and then
>>>saying it's too much. There are MANY brave
>>>contestants who shared their story about being
>>>sexually violated over the years and surviving it.
>>>Mallory's platform was regarding childhood sexual
>>>abuse. MAO, YOU created these rules that a
>contestant
>>>needed to show a commitment to a specific platform.
>>>And then when someone wants to take on something
>>>uncomfortable, you want them to shut up? I do hope
>>>that Katelynne has a chance to speak out in the media
>>>and confront this. And I hope this story does not
>>>disappear. As far as NBC, they kept their own
>predator
>>>on the air for several years until finally women came
>>>forward and forced them to do something about it.
>>>They have no moral high ground here, but I'm not
>>>surprised. I know there is a camp out there who
>>>thinks Sam Haskell would have been better right now.
>>>I say no, because when you demean women, it's the
>same
>>>thing as NBC and the current MAO did to Katelynne.
>>>Same thing, there's no difference.
>>>
>>>And there is the other problem. Supposedly, Texas
>>>wanted to leave this week. Oregon, the preliminary
>>>interview winner, called for transparency. I think
>>>that something went seriously wrong during pageant
>>>week. Last year, titleholders like Christine
>>>Williamson and Annie Jorgensen came forward and
>talked
>>>about their experiences. I highly doubt it has been
>>>easier on this year's contestants. During the
>>>"orientation", it was reported that the contestants
>>>were told they had to tow the line or else. I think
>>>they were intimidated into what we saw this week.
>>>There seems to be at least some thought that this was
>>>pre-determined for Camille to win. I think there
>>>might have been a push to pick a certain "type" of
>>>winner. I am listening to Betty and Savvy as they
>are
>>>talking, and they are concerned that this has become
>>>an academic competition. It's always been that you
>>>attract academic types and had someone like Erika
>>>Harold win. But I also strongly agree that it seems
>>>like with these changes that you have to be a certain
>>>kind of woman. Now, I do think that Camille is very
>>>pretty and she looks like what you think a Miss
>>>America should look like. Some people felt that she
>>>pandered to win. I don't know what to think. I do
>>>have a different theory. Last year during Nia's
>>>interview, she said that she brought in sponsors.
>>>During the post crowning conference, Camille said
>that
>>>she was approached by corporate sponsors. Is this
>>>part of the "judging" factor now-how much the
>>>contestant can bring in? But then again, how the
>hell
>>>can they keep sponsors right now and keep them
>happy?
>>>They all jumped ship with the Haskell scandal and
>>>NOBODY came on with these so-called changes. There
>is
>>>no proper management. Camille can probably align
>with
>>>large multi-million dollar pharmaceutical companies
>>>whereas Georgia would have aligned with children who
>>>are so poor their foster families can get public
>>>assistance for them. There was no money in her
>>>platform. I HOPE I am wrong.
>>>
>>>And then there was the issue of asking about children
>>>and being married. I think it is completely
>>>acceptable to be in a relationship and be Miss
>>>America. Now as far as being married or divorced and
>>>being Miss America. The reality is that most young
>>>people are delaying marriage to their late 20s and
>>>early 30s at least as well as child-rearing. That is
>>>our society. If you happen to get married young
>under
>>>the age of 25 (the current MAO limit) or before, it's
>>>not the norm. If you are on the road for 300 days a
>>>year, how can you grow your young marriage? And how
>>>could you justify leaving a small child alone for a
>>>year and more? If you are competing for a state
>>>pageant, you are still very busy. This isn't the job
>>>for a parent or young wife. And if you happen to be
>>>under 25 and divorced, that's a rough ride of it. I
>>>had a few friends who married that young, it was a
>>>mistake for them, and they were devastated that their
>>>lives were affected by divorce at such a young age.
>>>You think they want to turn around and do a pageant
>to
>>>get over the devastation of the death of a marriage?
>>>Some of these things just do not make sense. I know
>>>both GA and VA took some slack for their answers, but
>>>I don't think it's realistic to be Miss America and
>be
>>>a mother to a small child. And I don't think it's
>>>healthy to have a young marriage and expect to grow
>it
>>>properly. Ask anyone and they will tell you the
>first
>>>few years of marriage are the hardest. It's not
>about
>>>whether you support women or not, it's more about
>>>growing a healthy marriage. You can do both. I
>don't
>>>think it is wrong to consider the emotional effects
>of
>>>having an absentee mother, which is what you would be
>>>if you were off traveling the country when your child
>>>is very young.
>>>
>>>It looks like we are right back where we started from
>>>before this nonsense, and now it did have a national
>>>stage for a night. NOBODY likes these changes, and
>>>that has to be addressed. My wild and crazy
>traveling
>>>companion said this-we would possibly go to a 100th
>>>anniversary Miss America pageant or whatever. But
>>>after that, we will not be going if it is like this.
>>>They touted that they were online now during the
>>>preliminary nights. I saw my first online pageant in
>>>2002, Miss Ohio. And I had dialup still. This is
>not
>>>groundbreaking. But it's not worth it to have the
>>>non-contestants there for two days in the winter with
>>>bad travel and nothing to do otherwise. And two
>>>nights of essentially speaking with a little bit of
>>>talent thrown in is not worth it.

[> [> [> [> Subject: Yes, some of the pharmaceutical companies who cause these problems, much like cigarette companies who want to promote nicotine safety, will pay for someone to "help" and some commercial outreach. It's all smoke and mirrors, though.

Author:
Owner/Moderator
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 20:21:31 12/30/19 Mon

>>>>I just want to comment on the pure chaos that has
>>>>happened after the pageant. First of all, Katelynne
>>>>Cox came out and said that she was silenced by NBC
>>and
>>>>the MAO. The pageant happened 24 hours after the
>>>>third time in our nation's history where a president
>>>>has been impeached. There was a primary debate
>>>>happening at the same time. But what she said was
>>>>quite newsworthy and had it not happened during that
>>>>time, I think it would have been the story that hit
>>>>the news. It still might. I read Marilyn
>>VanDerbur's
>>>>book, and she talked about how she was coming out as
>>a
>>>>childhood sexual abuse survivor around the time she
>>>>was asked to judge. She told NBC that she would
>only
>>>>judge if she was announced as a sexual abuse
>>survivor.
>>>> From what I remember, they didn't initially feel
>>>>comfortable with it, but she was insistent. And she
>>>>was able to judge and be announced as a sexual abuse
>>>>survivor. That was either 1990 or 1991. How
>>shameful
>>>>that we went backwards 30 years later. And how
>>>>shameful and hypocritical of the MAO for saying that
>>>>this is supposed to be about social impacts and then
>>>>saying it's too much. There are MANY brave
>>>>contestants who shared their story about being
>>>>sexually violated over the years and surviving it.
>>>>Mallory's platform was regarding childhood sexual
>>>>abuse. MAO, YOU created these rules that a
>>contestant
>>>>needed to show a commitment to a specific platform.
>>>>And then when someone wants to take on something
>>>>uncomfortable, you want them to shut up? I do hope
>>>>that Katelynne has a chance to speak out in the
>media
>>>>and confront this. And I hope this story does not
>>>>disappear. As far as NBC, they kept their own
>>predator
>>>>on the air for several years until finally women
>came
>>>>forward and forced them to do something about it.
>>>>They have no moral high ground here, but I'm not
>>>>surprised. I know there is a camp out there who
>>>>thinks Sam Haskell would have been better right
>now.
>>>>I say no, because when you demean women, it's the
>>same
>>>>thing as NBC and the current MAO did to Katelynne.
>>>>Same thing, there's no difference.
>>>>
>>>>And there is the other problem. Supposedly, Texas
>>>>wanted to leave this week. Oregon, the preliminary
>>>>interview winner, called for transparency. I think
>>>>that something went seriously wrong during pageant
>>>>week. Last year, titleholders like Christine
>>>>Williamson and Annie Jorgensen came forward and
>>talked
>>>>about their experiences. I highly doubt it has been
>>>>easier on this year's contestants. During the
>>>>"orientation", it was reported that the contestants
>>>>were told they had to tow the line or else. I think
>>>>they were intimidated into what we saw this week.
>>>>There seems to be at least some thought that this
>was
>>>>pre-determined for Camille to win. I think there
>>>>might have been a push to pick a certain "type" of
>>>>winner. I am listening to Betty and Savvy as they
>>are
>>>>talking, and they are concerned that this has become
>>>>an academic competition. It's always been that you
>>>>attract academic types and had someone like Erika
>>>>Harold win. But I also strongly agree that it seems
>>>>like with these changes that you have to be a
>certain
>>>>kind of woman. Now, I do think that Camille is very
>>>>pretty and she looks like what you think a Miss
>>>>America should look like. Some people felt that she
>>>>pandered to win. I don't know what to think. I do
>>>>have a different theory. Last year during Nia's
>>>>interview, she said that she brought in sponsors.
>>>>During the post crowning conference, Camille said
>>that
>>>>she was approached by corporate sponsors. Is this
>>>>part of the "judging" factor now-how much the
>>>>contestant can bring in? But then again, how the
>>hell
>>>>can they keep sponsors right now and keep them
>>happy?
>>>>They all jumped ship with the Haskell scandal and
>>>>NOBODY came on with these so-called changes. There
>>is
>>>>no proper management. Camille can probably align
>>with
>>>>large multi-million dollar pharmaceutical companies
>>>>whereas Georgia would have aligned with children who
>>>>are so poor their foster families can get public
>>>>assistance for them. There was no money in her
>>>>platform. I HOPE I am wrong.
>>>>
>>>>And then there was the issue of asking about
>children
>>>>and being married. I think it is completely
>>>>acceptable to be in a relationship and be Miss
>>>>America. Now as far as being married or divorced
>and
>>>>being Miss America. The reality is that most young
>>>>people are delaying marriage to their late 20s and
>>>>early 30s at least as well as child-rearing. That
>is
>>>>our society. If you happen to get married young
>>under
>>>>the age of 25 (the current MAO limit) or before,
>it's
>>>>not the norm. If you are on the road for 300 days a
>>>>year, how can you grow your young marriage? And how
>>>>could you justify leaving a small child alone for a
>>>>year and more? If you are competing for a state
>>>>pageant, you are still very busy. This isn't the
>job
>>>>for a parent or young wife. And if you happen to be
>>>>under 25 and divorced, that's a rough ride of it. I
>>>>had a few friends who married that young, it was a
>>>>mistake for them, and they were devastated that
>their
>>>>lives were affected by divorce at such a young age.
>>>>You think they want to turn around and do a pageant
>>to
>>>>get over the devastation of the death of a
>marriage?
>>>>Some of these things just do not make sense. I know
>>>>both GA and VA took some slack for their answers,
>but
>>>>I don't think it's realistic to be Miss America and
>>be
>>>>a mother to a small child. And I don't think it's
>>>>healthy to have a young marriage and expect to grow
>>it
>>>>properly. Ask anyone and they will tell you the
>>first
>>>>few years of marriage are the hardest. It's not
>>about
>>>>whether you support women or not, it's more about
>>>>growing a healthy marriage. You can do both. I
>>don't
>>>>think it is wrong to consider the emotional effects
>>of
>>>>having an absentee mother, which is what you would
>be
>>>>if you were off traveling the country when your
>child
>>>>is very young.
>>>>
>>>>It looks like we are right back where we started
>from
>>>>before this nonsense, and now it did have a national
>>>>stage for a night. NOBODY likes these changes, and
>>>>that has to be addressed. My wild and crazy
>>traveling
>>>>companion said this-we would possibly go to a 100th
>>>>anniversary Miss America pageant or whatever. But
>>>>after that, we will not be going if it is like
>this.
>>>>They touted that they were online now during the
>>>>preliminary nights. I saw my first online pageant
>in
>>>>2002, Miss Ohio. And I had dialup still. This is
>>not
>>>>groundbreaking. But it's not worth it to have the
>>>>non-contestants there for two days in the winter
>with
>>>>bad travel and nothing to do otherwise. And two
>>>>nights of essentially speaking with a little bit of
>>>>talent thrown in is not worth it.

[> Subject: Nia got us no new sponsors. Interviews are a bunch of fibs, no one ever vets.
Author: No name [ Edit \| View ]	Date Posted: 11:22:36 12/22/19 Sun

[> [> Subject: I wonder if she meant as Miss New York. The only plus at the time that I saw with Nia is that she was aligned with some high profile musicians and groups in NYC. I thought that it might help to bring in some publicity at the very least, but it never did. Right now, we need a miracle for the organization to survive. It will mean getting some good sponsors, but who wants to sponsor this mess?

Author:
Owner/Moderator
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Date Posted: 12:56:53 12/22/19 Sun

[> Subject: I disagree on some points

Author:
But I love your forum!!
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Date Posted: 23:01:13 12/23/19 Mon

I don’t see that gaining sponsors as a bad thing. It’s part of the marketing plan, so it is fair game as criteria for choosing a winner (it’s in the paperwork). It has been a selling point for candidates in her state, no matter what their platform, so I would not say that Victoria didn’t have the same opportunity to bring sponsors. Someone could sponsor items or scholarship money, but they can also promise to book appearances or be willing to cover appearance fees, which bring in money for the MAO and Miss America.
I’ve heard the argument that a board has already chosen a “type” of candidate they wanted at just about every pageant I’ve attended. And I believe they do. But, again, I don’t think that’s a problem, either. Of course they want a particular type of girl to represent their organization: it’s spelled out in the competition areas and the mission of the group.
I also think that if Victoria had won, any girl who doesn't have a talent that requires classical training would not choose this system because the message would have been this is what we want because both MAO 2.0 queens would have been opera singers. By choosing Camille, the message is you can win without being classically trained.
But, I believe that the main reason she didn’t win was because she didn’t answer her last question.

[> [> Subject: Welcome, I am glad you are here! And this board is for everyone, with differing opinions. I am always up for a good, respectable debate. So if you ever have something on your mind, please post!

Author:
Owner/Moderator
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Date Posted: 20:23:05 12/30/19 Mon

>I don’t see that gaining sponsors as a bad thing.
>It’s part of the marketing plan, so it is fair game
>as criteria for choosing a winner (it’s in the
>paperwork). It has been a selling point for candidates
>in her state, no matter what their platform, so I
>would not say that Victoria didn’t have the same
>opportunity to bring sponsors. Someone could sponsor
>items or scholarship money, but they can also promise
>to book appearances or be willing to cover appearance
>fees, which bring in money for the MAO and Miss
>America.
>I’ve heard the argument that a board has already
>chosen a “type” of candidate they wanted at just
>about every pageant I’ve attended. And I believe
>they do. But, again, I don’t think that’s a
>problem, either. Of course they want a particular type
>of girl to represent their organization: it’s
>spelled out in the competition areas and the mission
>of the group.
>I also think that if Victoria had won, any girl who
>doesn't have a talent that requires classical training
>would not choose this system because the message would
>have been this is what we want because both MAO 2.0
>queens would have been opera singers. By choosing
>Camille, the message is you can win without being
>classically trained.
>But, I believe that the main reason she didn’t win
>was because she didn’t answer her last question.

[> Subject: I think married women and mothers should have every right to enter. Let the judges decide if they're up to the task.

Author:
No name
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Date Posted: 22:42:28 12/27/19 Fri

[> [> Subject: With these judges, they might not have thought it an issue. I would think if they had former Miss Americas on the panel, they might not feel the same. I would say that it is fine line between not allowing women in the 21st century and whether it is a good idea or not. It's worthy of a debate. I just think that with a traveling position, it's not a good fit.

Author:
Owner/Moderator
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Date Posted: 20:51:58 12/30/19 Mon

[> Subject: I'm curious about these corporate sponsors. I can't wait to see who they are! She stated she was approached while being MIss Virginia, but I am assume it would translate for a notable national sponsor. It wasn't revealed during her time as Miss Virginia.

Author:
So, the competition may not be as important as who brings what.
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Date Posted: 13:32:45 12/30/19 Mon

[> [> Subject: If she can get some pharmaceuticals, it would be a big deal. Purportedly, Nicole Johnson earned $500K her year and that was 20 years ago. I think there were several reasons for Camille's win, but I do think that like in Nia's case, the sponsor talk only helped. But I still think MAO has major problems holding onto sponsors. So, they better learn how to work with them properly.

Author:
Owner/Moderator
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Date Posted: 20:55:09 12/30/19 Mon