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Date Posted: 13:14:31 11/19/09 Thu
Author: Jenny W
Subject: Re: Might as well start a new topic for this Jordan
In reply to: Sandra Brownlie 's message, "Might as well start a new topic for this Jordan" on 05:57:30 11/19/09 Thu

I like Jj too, but as you say, she is a bit of a conformational conundrum. I really like her nature, she is tough but reliable and sweet enough to cuddle in front of the fire!
Bronson on the other hand is far more correct in make (well he was when I last saw him anyway!) and his front is far superior to Jj's, although if I remember correctly she has a bit more angulation behind. Both are good dogs and excellent in type. Jj is too masculine in the head and a bit lippy (not unlike her owner) but I know you know this and are working on it with the male she is planned to breed to, who is correct in head and not overdone. As for her elbows, well you know how I feel about this and you know my own policy on breeding from not so special health scores, having bred a litter from a bitch that scored 3:3 in elbows and 0:0 in hips. To me, it is knowing about it and how you deal with it that counts and of course taking the whole dog into consideration, not one individual fault or virtue. If we throw out every dog that has a fault or imperfect health score, we'll not have enough good dogs left to produce quality dogs from for the future. I sometimes think that breeders don't do health tests because they are frightened that if the dog scores less than ideal, or even badly, they will be forced or heckled by the gallery into removing that dog from their breeding program, regardless of the other virtues the dog can bring to the table. I've taken a little flack (surprisingly little actually or maybe I've just not heard it!) for breeding from my Mousey with her poor elbows, but I feel totally happy and justified in doing so, because of the other qualities she has AND by knowing her elbow status, I was able to go to another health tested dog that I KNEW had clear elbows, to minimise the potential effect of her own. Health testing means you CAN use dogs with not so special results, but only to other dogs that you also know the status of. It's the ONLY sensible policy when quality dogs are in short supply and some of the older lines are becoming less available and yet still have a lot to offer the breed. My Mousey, like Jj, has an awful lot to offer and some of those things are already lost in so many dogs being bred now and I'm seeing the results in her offspring already. Strong healthy dogs of outstanding confidence, energy and agility. Already displaying some of those old traits of tracking, guarding and good body language and an attraction to children I've not seen before. Not small either. Look at Jaffa. I wonder where else I could have produced this type and this temperament if I hadn't been brave(?) enough to breed from Mousey with her old and now pretty unobtainable lines. What a tragedy it would have been if these had been lost to the breed. Of course it's a risk, but is it a risk worth taking when you can't get what you want anywhere else? If those pups end up with not so clever elbows they will still have brought quality, temperament, size and type to the gene pool that could not have been obtained in this format for future use otherwise. We now have dogs of almost completely outcross breeding (COI reduced from 11% in the mother to 2% in the offspring) carrying these things and that has to be a good thing doesn't it? Useful for the future? It's the same with your girl, used sensibly and to other health tested stock she has the ability to produce outstanding dogs of real value in the future. But ignorance is a funny thing and when you are criticised in the future by some smart Alec who throws the fact that you have bred from "unhealthy" dogs at you, you can hold your head up high and justify your decisions based on real breeding facts, and when you compare your results a few generations down the line with those people, you can smile and wave!
Good luck with Jj's future pups I hope she produces quality dogs and you see some improvement in elbows. I'm hoping for the same.

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