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Date Posted: 20:33:01 02/28/06 Tue
Author: chrys
Subject: love gone wrong
chico's thread inspired me to want to put my own love troubles out there. i want to start out by saying this has been one of the absolute hardest, most difficult winters of my life, with my friend's suicide attempt, family troubles and everything else.
so things were pretty good w/the guy while he was living here. things were awesome. we hung out all the time, and then i finally let him know i was interested in more than just hanging out, lol. i also want to say that though i liked him a lot from the very beginning, i never took things too seriously at all. i figured we'd be freinds and maybe fool around and that's that. i wasn't going to even entertain the thought of it being anything more than that, more than fun. i really have a difficult time letting people in, and so if i had thought of it as anything more, early on, i probably would have hid in my room until after he moved out, lol.
so he moved out right around the time the forum went down, maybe even the same freakin' day actually i am pretty sure. for awhile things were great still. he'd call and come over and we'd hang out and talk (we have trouble watching any movies all the way through w/o stopping to just talk, talk, talk) and have sex and etc, things were wonderful. more than wonderful, lol. so then a couple days after my friend's attempt, he came over. that night things were just great and normal. the next day, we're watching a movie together that takes place in his hometown and he kept pausing it to tell me things, like certain scenes would remind him of stories from his life. one of them was about a real good friend of his who died and he got too upset to even finish telling the story. i touched his arm, but i didn't know really what to do, other than my bro when he was little no guy has ever cried in front of me. i wanted to put my arm around him but was afraid that wasn't what he wanted. so i didn't. the whole rest of the night was a little tense i think for both of us. i felt something change when he told me that story, and how i could feel for him as he told it, like i was almost on the verge of tears myself. while we were watching the movie he just kept squeezing my hand. usually we are more playful like play fighting and stuff but that night it was different, more like he was really holding onto me. when we went to bed that night he said he was tired and just held onto me like a spoon, and tighter than ever before, and fell asleep. and i was all upset that we didn't have sex...like i said on that other thread, the monster has been unleashed, and when he's here i could do it like ten times a day, lol.
so then after that, we continue to not have sex, though he was still here for awhile. during the day we'd talk and he'd just tell me more and more stuff about his life. i was surprised cuz from day one i have known he is guarded, that even way before this i knew stuff about him that probably hardly anyone else knows cuz he doesn't talk about it. so as he's telling more and more, i was just surprised. and i didn't say as much about my own life, perhaps i am even more guarded. he kept telling me how comfortable he felt w/me, and all this stuff. also when we were talking about writing (he writes, and wants me to help him work on some) he told me a couple days in a row, you're quite the inspiration. and hte way he was looking at me when he said it, i knew he meant it. so it's like we were getting closer and closer, except no more sex. i was too scared to ask him about it, too sure he wasn't attracted to me anymore (which is sorta my knee-jerk response anyway) or that the sex wasn't good for him cuz i am so new at it (i can't believe i'm fucking posting this, btw) (btw i never even told him he was my first - maybe he figured it out i dunno, but i was too embarrassed to say anything). after a few nights of this he stopped even sleeping in the bed w/me, he'd pass out in the reclining chair instead and i was even more confused.
so after like five days since the night of the movie, things reached a breaking point for me. we were drunk and listening to tool. things had been really good that day, more talking about the writing stuff, and he was trying to find mp3s of his old band cuz he wanted me to hear it, and more telling me how comfortable he felt with me, etc. also every day he would totally clean my room from the night before and we had like total movie marathons that week and he would always read the words on the screen to me cuz i can't read them, so i thought things were fine. then we're listening to tool and schism comes on and he said this brings back memories, so i asked good or bad and he said both. he was sitting on the bed and i could see the wheels turning in his head, so finally (after much should i shouldn't i) i went over and sat next to him and put my arm around him. he moved my hand and said "i'm thinking right now," or something like that, and drunk as i was, that was it, i just burst into tears. i've also hardly ever cried in front of anyone (that was a HUGE no no growing up, probably the biggest) so then i got mad at myself for crying and just thought he would certainly hate me now. he kept asking what was wrong, saying talk to me, just spit it out, but i couldn't really, still scared. though finally i said i was upset that he wasn't sleeping in the bed w/me (which was part of it but not all) and he was like no, that has nothing to do w/you at all, so on and so on, seemed surprised i would even take it personally, like that's it, that's what you're upset about? oh darling it's nothing personal, it's not about you AT ALL, and so on (yes he calls me darling, and sweetie and sweetheart). then he started telling me to go to sleep cuz i was tipsy and we'd talk in the morning. he also tried to get me to tell him what was wrong but i just couldn't. then i started getting mean (yeah i know a great way to go about it) and then i turned away from him and cried some more for awhile (btw i was saying stuff like i'm sure i've ruined everything, cuz i was SO sure that if i cried in front of him he'd be DONE w/my sorry ass, and he just looked at me all bewildered lol). so finally (and btw it's like after three in the morning) i sorta rally myself to just ask him point blank if he's still attracted to me or not or what is the deal w/the sex thing but by the time i get the courage to do it, he's asleep in the chair. i thought he was faking it to avoid me so i was like please talk to me i'm ready to spit it out and when he didn't wake up still, i slapped him. i know that's pretty inexcusable. he was pissed then, like whoa what, and then i started crying again and i told him i wanted him to go home first thing in the morning and he was like, okay i will. then i was like, we can't even be friends after this, and he was like, the way you're acting i guess not. then i cried some more and he said go to sleep sweetheart we'll talk in the morning. then a few minutes later he asked for a pillow and i gave him one.
of course i woke up like two hours later like holy fucking shit what did i do? i felt so awful, and rightfully so. i also felt like all i wanted to do was curl up next to him put my arms around him and tell him how truly sorry i was. i finally went back to sleep and we woke up when his friend who he works and lives with came to pick him up. so he had to leave pretty quick and as he was gathering his things, i told him i'm sorry, and he said shit happens you don't have to be sorry, and i said well i slapped you and i said somethings i honestly didn't mean (i felt like a bazillion times worse about that than the slapping actually, i guess cuz if it had been me, that's the part that i would have been hurt by). he said he knew i didn't mean it at the time even when i said it and not to worry. then he asked for a hug goodbye.
so the next night he calls me up and is like can i come over. i was shocked, but i said yes and he walked all the way here at like eleven at night (it's like a half hour walk at least). so he gets here and he's telling me every little thing that happened b/w then and the last time he saw me, all like thirty hours of it or whatever, lol. then he tells me some stories about two of his friends on the island and slips in there something personal about himself that i think is pretty difficult for a dude to say. then we tried watching a movie but again had to stop it like every two minutes to talk. i told him i'd seen my name in a book i'd copyedited, i ran into the author's husband earlier that day and he showed me the acknowledgements section, and my guy was like i'm so happy for you, really really happy for you. oh and when he was first there i teased him like oh are you going to sleep in the chair again tonight and he said no i really need to sleep in a real bed, but he slept in the chair again! the next day we're hanging out and he watches one of my favorite movies w/me (white oleander) and asks if he can borrow my copy of the book. i was soooo psyched about that, and excited to talk to him about it. that night things were a little strained, i was still upset about the sleeping in the chair/not having sex thing, and there was one point where he wanted to go watch tv in the living room and i told him to go on ahead cuz i wanted to be alone. after that he was definitely more distant w/me that night and of course he slept in the fucking chair again.
the next day was my bday and his friend again woke us both up by coming over to get him. he got ready to go and said happy bday and again asked for a hug and said he'd call me.
and that was the last i heard from him for a long time. i didn't know what to think. i was partly just pissed and hurt, and partly mad at myself for really not being as forthcoming w/him as he was w/me, and for being a fucking wacko that night that i slapped him. so this past saturday, three weeks after my bday, i called over there. oh this is hte other thing, the house he moved into is a fucking nuthouse and he doesn't have his own phone so i always have to call the dude who came here to get him (who also used to live here) and leave msgs w/him, and that guy is a fucking DRUNK. i mean i have known drunks before and i enjoy drinking myself but this guy is like...i don't even know. so i'm always like wondering if my dude even ever hears the msgs. but i called on sat (i had really laid low before that figuring he needed his space or whatever) and that night he called me back, twice. i guess hte first time i had the music on so loud in here i never heard the phone ring, or the msg he left, lol. when i finally saw it and went to play it the phone rang again and it was him. he sounded totally happy to hear from me, assured me he wasn't mad or anything, told me he'd been writing a lot and wants me to look at it. he asked about the landlord (he hates coming here when the LL is here, the LL is a bit of a snoop, well that's an understatement, he's a total eavesdropper, whether its like ppl talking in hte house, or if i show off my room to ppl in my writing group, he's always listening) and i said he hasn't been around so much, so then my guy says to call him the next day (it was midnight already) and he'd come over. i was ALL excited. he also said he was half tempted to come over right then, like just walk over and show up. so i was all like yay! then i call the next day, leave a msg on the drunk guy's phone, and get no call back. tried again yesterday, same thing. i left a msg again today. we'll see what happens.
but i just don't know what to think? a huge part of me just wants to throw in the towel. i feel heartbroken. i realize that trying to keep it light and keep myself distant at the beginning didn't save me any of the heartache in the end, cuz of course with all that time and all that sharing it became more than just oh this is fun. i just don't know what to do. this is the closest i have let myself get to anyone in a long time, and i feel like it was all for nothing, and that i never really let myelf get close anyway. like i'm caught b/w feeling that like, oh i finally let myself care about someone then poof, and thinking, i let this whole thing slip away w/o ever revealing how i felt or who i am (i am really really cautious about letting ppl know how i feel, i know i was not good about that w/him, too scared). also b/c this is my first relationship in so long, i feel like, fuck i don't have a clue what i'm doing. i don't know what's normal. i do know i should have been staright up about what was bothering me instead of slapping him. but i also don't know like, it is normal to like start getting closer and closer to someone and at the same time stop sleeping w/them?
anyway this is like the longest post ever, i guess i have been meaning to post it for a long time now. in my shoes, what would you all think/do?
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Re: love gone wrong -- 23, 22:06:50 02/28/06 Tue [1]
Be honest.
Tell him everything you just told us.
You obviously don't want to just keep it light, or you wouldn't care this much. You're a terribly strong person, Chrys, stop trying to protect yourself. Put it out there. If you get hurt, you get hurt. You'll get over it in time, and you'll be a better person for having gone through it.
You know that part of you that's ready to just throw in the towel? The part that feels a little relief thinking about blowing it all off and moving on? That's cowardice. That's the relief that comes from walking away from something difficult. That relief will be short-lived and will quickly be replaced by regret.
Like I told chico, don't play the games. The games are a filter between you and him. They are making it impossible for you to actually get to know each other. The only you that he knows is the tiny little piece of you that you've let him see.
Maybe he's more perceptive than you give him credit for. Maybe he's distancing himself from you a bit because he can sense how much you're holding back. Maybe he was hurt that you didn't hug him when he cried. Maybe he's felt like he's pushing things too quickly and he's backing off because he feels your reluctance.
I don't know. I can only speculate, just like you.
You need to talk to him, and be honest. Who knows, amazing things may come of it.
(happiness)
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Re: love gone wrong -- chico781, 23:42:03 02/28/06 Tue [1]
From my own experience, I know that it is very hard to just let go and open up to a person because we're afraid of getting hurt but once we do, we can experience so much more. With the sex thing, it seems like to me that you became more important to him than just someone to have sex with. By what you have told us, it seems like he wanted something more than that. I think that you should put it out on the table for him. Open up to him and let him see the whole you and not just the parts you show everyone else.
I wish you the best of luck. I honestly think that he does have feelings for you and I think that you guys can work it out. It's ok to be inexperienced. I know that I made a lot of mistakes in my own relationship but the important thing is trying to grow from them. I hope you can do that.
Sergio
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 01:21:09 03/01/06 Wed [1]
23 - i should give you a cookie for even reading that whole thing : )
and yeah, i know it's not light and fun anymore, i knew it the day that he cried. i think it was true even before that, but it was like i FELT everything change in the room in that moment, and it's like even before that i knew i had more feelings/attachment than just "oh this is fun" but that night i really felt it, i knew i would use the word "love." lol i don't know what my problem is it's like part of me is disgusted w/myself for getting that way, but who can ever help these things???
i also assumed all through the beginning that it was just fun and flirty for him too. i guess cuz i didn't know him well and that stupid tina told me (the same night she found out i slept in his room and got all jealous) that he always had girls over. i had barely lived here more than a week so what did i know? i figured it was easier to assume something like that was true, than to expect anything. i am not sure exactly how important i was or wasn't to him, but i think that assumption was the wrong move too. i was just so afraid of being a stupid girl, you know? all sappy, or some stupid girl who gets all attached after we have sex or something like that. but truth be told i think i was somewhat attached before even that, and i think in his own way he was too.
jesus christ he even told me he loved me once, but he said it semi in jest and in the heat of passion so i totally blew it off like oh he doesn't mean that, and still told myself that this was allllll fun and friendly and nothing more. and any time i think of talking to him i always want to say things like, and if you don't have feeligns for me or you're not attracted to me, just tell me now. and when i realized i loved him, omg how i freaked, and he was here. i never said anything but i was just so sure that if he knew he'd be outta here.
if there is one thing i've learned from this, it's that you can't save yourself from hurt, unless you are a hermit and i've been there and i know that hurts too in its own way. i am embarrassed about the fact that i get attached so easily, but i guess if that's the way it is, then that's the way it is. think i went a little extreme in the other direction w/this guy, and i totally have regrets already. it will make me VERY sad if t his whole thing is totally over and like, i never gave him a chance to know me, w/someone who i think would have wanted to know.
twan thank you for this part:
You know that part of you that's ready to just throw in the towel? The part that feels a little relief thinking about blowing it all off and moving on? That's cowardice. That's the relief that comes from walking away from something difficult. That relief will be short-lived and will quickly be replaced by regret."
that crystallized things for me in a way that i couldn't see on my own. especially when you talked about "that part that feels a little relief..." it's like, you have it so pegged, lol.
so what do i do? the guy isn't calling me back. maybe isn't getting my msgs. the one night he did call, i had left on the msg to the other guy "make sure AJ gets this..." so i don't know if the drunk dude doesn't pass on the other msgs or what. i have thought about writing a letter, but i have hesitation about that, b/c i tend to go on and on (bet you all could never guess) and i tend not to get good responses, historically, from guys who i write to, and i'm talking like HS on. then again i can't assume again that just b/c it ended shitty other times that it will this time, or that it even matters. it's just hard to get ahold of this guy. i also don't wnat to like invite him over here and then ambush him with "we need to talk," lol. he prob knows it too just not sure how to address it, w/all the "communication breakdown." i even wrote a sample letter the other day, but i dunno what i'll do with it.
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Re: love gone wrong -- lump, 09:52:25 03/01/06 Wed [1]
I remember slapping my b-friend once. We were waiting for a friend at a gas station. Here I am - Princess in the passanger seat - and he stops what he's doing to watch this skank ho walk by. I mean his head moved step by step. And she was my complete opposite. Dark straight hair - hillbilly girl build (no meat or curves or boobs - only Olive Oil knees in Daisy Dukes). I was so insulted that I reached over and smacked him HARD before I even realized I had decided to do it. I remember that draw back - that "Oh my God" amazement. I apologized profusely - as there's never a good reason to hit someone - but inside I still felt he had it coming. I'm lucky he took me home and didn't just leave me there. Anyhow - I know that cat-like feeling.
Do yourself a favor in any relationship. I know you're just starting out in the relationship world. But don't make any bad habits now - like not talking about yourself, only being a listener, and not just spitting it out. I don't know much about relationships (obviously), but I do know where I have gone wrong. But definately do yourself the favor of speaking out. If you feel it - say it. If you wonder, wonder out loud. It's not fair to hold in and in the end...you suffer instead of 'save.'
As woman, and to create that cat-like wonder - we "save" things. "Oh, he doesn't want to hear about my cramps." And he doesn't. But he's also wondering why you're grumpy.
"Oh, I can't cry around him. He'll run screaming." Cry if you want to cry. If he runs screaming, he's not the right one anyhow. "I don't want to seem...." But you are. "I'm bothered by this, but it's not that important and I don't want to seem demanding or bitchy." It is important. Otherwise he doesn't know. I think it's a female tendancy to hold back - maybe because we have to so much as mothers - maybe it's a maternal thing. But don't sabotage yourself by doing that EVER in a relationship.
As for the sex part - I don't get that either. It can't be "bad," so knock that out of your head. It's not you. But if you're feeling inexperienced or like you don't know what you're doing - ask. Mostly they like that. But I don't know why he wouldn't make a move. Maybe he's cheating or maybe he just wants a girl friend, and not a girlfriend? I'd maybe go get tested for VDs if I were you (in case that's the reason). It's hard to tell - and sex is definately one of those things that's tricky to talk about - but do. For yourself if no one else.
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 10:52:23 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Has it gone wrong or just ended?
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 12:16:26 03/01/06 Wed [1]
yep. of course i wish i had realized a lot of this sooner, or asked you guys sooner, lol. it may well be too late to fix anything, but i think i need to clear some of this up, for my own sake, and in a way to right what i have made a mess of. hindsight is so 20/20, you know? if i had it to do over of course i wouldn't hold back as much in all dimensions, i would have just asked what was going on, i would have hugged him when he cried (i do wonder if that's part of it, cuz that was the day we stopped having sex), and just in general been more forthcoming. guess it is something to learn for next time, and also to try to deal with this time. i feel like even if it's totally too late, i should still say something so as not to leave us both hanging. well, it's not easy, but what is? lol. i've been trying to talk myself so much into not having to talk to him about any of this, w/every excuse in the book. i might as well just face up and do it, regardless of how it might turn out.
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 12:33:06 03/01/06 Wed [1]
ps. lump, do you realize you quoted SG in there?
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 12:35:12 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Yeah she did I just noticed.
"Cry if you want to cry"
ha
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Re: love gone wrong -- 23, 12:52:32 03/01/06 Wed [1]
"lol i don't know what my problem is it's like part of me is disgusted w/myself for getting that way, but who can ever help these things???"
Why are you disgusted with yourself for falling in love? Do you see that as a weakness in yourself or something? I think it's a strength. Guarding yourself from reality by denying your feelings is weakness. Opening up to them and being who you really are is strength. How is it a bad thing to be someone who loves others easily? If only the rest of the world had that same problem, Chrys, I think we would all be much better off.
I think you and I are a lot alike in this way. Rachel and I told eachother we loved eachother just a month or so into our romantic relationship (we were friends for awhile before that). It was terrifying to say it for fear that it wouldn't be reciprocated, but I would hate to think where I would be right now had I walked away based on that fear.
Embrace your feelings. And like I said, if you get rejected or this turns sour, you'll get over it and eventually be a better person for it down the line. And if nothing else, you'll have plenty of stuff to write about....
:)
What you should do now? I'm not sure, but I'll tell you what I would do. I would take a nice walk over to his place, thinking about exactly what I want to say to him on the way there. Try to gauge how important all of this is to you, and figure out how much of yourself you're willing to put on the line to try to fix this relationship. Then tell him how you feel. I can only guesstimate where he's coming from based on what you've written here, but unless he's already mentally moved on, I think he will only be happy to hear what you have to say.
Whatever you choose to do, I wish you luck.
And lastly, don't beat yourself up over any of this, regardless of how it turns out. There are no guide books telling us how to love and interact with one another. We're all flying by the seat of our pants, gleaning whatever bits and pieces of information we can from various sources around us. Some of us have built-in handicaps based on the relationships we grew up around and it takes some time and effort to move past those patterns.
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 13:51:10 03/01/06 Wed [1]
yeah i already have plenty to write about, that's for sure : )
also i think you are right actually, maybe i will go over there though i would feel extremely odd about going over anyone's house uninvited. i'd probably call first, or something. it's definitely important, i spent ALL of yesterday crying, lol, partly why it took me so long to post anything on this thread.
also from just hanging out with him, i know he is also pretty insecure. there was one time we were messing around and i said something and he thought i was making fun of him! i would NEVER do that, never, cuz i don't care who you are or what the other person means to you, if you're that intimate w/someone you're vulnerable and that just seems so wrong. anyway i was like, no i'm not. my point is that i know he is sometimes insecure, takes things personally when they're not meant to be, i have seen it a bunch of times. shit, come to think of it, that was the last night we did it. i think it's important for me to also actually tell him that he was my first - i mean it's got to be pretty confusing cuz first i didn't want to do it and then i waited a whole long while and then i did want to, and etc etc, i mean it could be pretty confusing for the other person.
also when i read what you said about yourself and R, about how you said stuff early on and were scared, i'm just thinking (putting myself in someone else's shoes for once instead of just living in my own fear) like what it must have felt like on his end, to have said certain things and not have them returned. i mean if it was me i would have been devastated...and cried and slapped people, lol. and yeah lump, i hear ya on that, i felt the same way like i did it before i knew i had even decided to slap him. and i don't really think he had it coming either (though it sounds like yours did), he was so freaking calm (and he was drunk too) the whole time i was raving mad, lol.
anyway i am sorta writing out right now what i want to say. i am sooo bad at talking, i may even have to actually read it out loud to him or something, how retarded is that? if he's mentally moved on, well then there's nothing i can do except clear the air. if he hasn't, maybe there is some chance. of course i am still hoping, i reeeeeally like this guy so much, much as i tried not to!
yes i feel like falling in love easy makes me weak, or means i get too attached too fast, or i'm not being realistic, i don't know. guess though if thats the way i am, then it is.
twan, you should quit your day job and be the next dr. phil, but cooler.
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 17:24:31 03/01/06 Wed [1]
so, i finished writing out what i want to say. it took me a long time to sort through what is important and what isn't, and also took a lot of time to just write. it only ended up being two and a half pages, in large type, that is like a record for me, i can easily go on fifteen, lol. i tried to boil it down and just be direct. so my thinking is, either i will see/hear from him and we can talk face to face here or at his place, and i will have the letter to read from if i get confuddled or forget how to talk, lol. and if i can't get ahold of him, i may run into one of the other dudes that lives there and just ask them to pass the letter on. i am not comfortable going over there, esp. as i don't even know the guy whose house it is and AJ is the most recent of them to move in. he also was talking last time he was here about moving into a different room in the house, so i'm not even sure where to find him. so unless i have an okay from one of the guys over there, i feel reeeeeeally weird just walking in, guess it is part how i was raised, it seems too impolite, it makes me feel like a stalker or an intruder, and i'm not okay w/that.
but i also did leave another msg on kelly's machine asking him to please tell AJ i want to talk to him. just don't know if kelly is at all reliable about msgs, or if hes' even home (he goes off island a lot) so that part is frustrating. whatever way it happens, i am committed to actually dealing with this and addressing it and being honest, and seeing where that takes me. i feel better about it now, like since i finished writing out the stuff. i'm not crying anymore for one thing, but i also feel resolved and strong, in my own way.
i will show you guys what it says if you want me too, lol. and i will definitely let you know what happens.
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Re: love gone wrong -- amadaun, 17:55:54 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Chrys, you express yourself so well in writing, why not just write everything down that you want to say?
And give it to him yourself, don't trust some flat mate you hardly know with something so precious.
hope you can sort it all out!!
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 20:02:06 03/01/06 Wed [1]
okay fuck it, i have learned enough that being chicken shit gets me nowhere. i am going to go over there tomorrow, uninvited or whatever, and i'm going to deliver it and leave it for him, or talk to him in person. a courageous part of me might even go now but like i said its a long walk and i already walked to town and back today and that's enough! his place is further than town, it's actually right across the street from my friend's (the one who attemtped suicide). in the morning i have a political thing to go to and can prob go from there. still feel VERY weird about just walking over there, esp as we have mostly hung out here, like i'm breaking lots of rules or whatever, but i guess i gotta do what i gotta do.
damn, they sure don't make it easy...god if i wasn't so tired i would just do it now while the energy is there...
i'm also still a little chicken!!!
cluck cluck!!!!!!!
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 21:25:46 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Get over there! Go for it.
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Re: love gone wrong -- Leo, 21:37:57 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Chrys - remember that when all is said and done the things you didn't do are the ones you'll regret, not the things you did and tried.
I have taken some advice for myself from this and Chico's thread..
Twan - seriously, you need to start your own loveline or something. Maybe an internet column, "dear twan". You give great advice, you're gonna have one lucky kid.
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 21:59:44 03/01/06 Wed [1]
yeah, quit that day job. i think lump should be on it too though. it'd be perfect, cuz you guys are both in OH. and people could call in all over the country and you guys'd be rollin' in the dough and then you could REALLY throw a forum party this summer, yeah.
okay so i told my roommate about the letter (not the jealous one, i try not to mention his name around her ever, why bring it up? she said something to me a couple weeks ago like asked how we were and i said fine and she said something like, "as long as he isn't taking advantage of you..." and it was right after we stopped having sex, and i was thinking to myself, oh i wish he was, lol). anyway so i told my OTHER roommate about the letter, and she's like i hope you didn't use the L word or anything, scare him off, and i was like oh shit, cuz i soooo overthought whether to sign it "love ya" or not, but then i did. i am still thinking it's prob okay, cuz first of all he used that word w/me a few times and second of all it's honest. just hope it's not too soon to say something like that, but it IS how i feel.
words, they can be so tricky
or you might say "the words we say never seem to live up to the ones inside my head..."
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Re: love gone wrong -- 23, 23:00:00 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Thanks Leo & Chrys.
I just gave my two weeks and registered the "deartwan.com" domain name. If I'm not swimming in cash by next Tuesday, you ladies owe me.
Big time.
(are you calling me gay?)
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 23:16:33 03/01/06 Wed [1]
oh just think how MUCH better this will be than dr. laura or dr. joy or loveline and whatever else. it really would rock.
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Re: love gone wrong -- LastingOne, 23:30:41 03/01/06 Wed [1]
Like I told Chico, you should really give yourself the grace to feel and be in this situation. Love and relationships are such a physical, mental, and energetic rollercoaster that we tend to react without logical reasoning...
or we tend to overcompensate with too much reasoning...
Vulnerability is scary. Nobody wants to hear any negativity from another person, especially with a situation that has been so electrifying yet frustrating. There are ways to address a situation without attacking the other person, which can lead to a snowball effect of defensiveness and catastrophizing.
If you want honest answers, just remember not to say statements like "You made me feel..." or "You did this..." for he will most likely shutdown and your frustration will only explode. Things like "I feel that when we are together, the energy and atmosphere is very tense (etc). I feel anxious and frsutrated (etc). Is that how you feel? Do you have suggestions on how to make the situation less tense?"
Good luck to you. Its never easy, but you'll never know until you ask!
Peace to you,
C
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Re: love gone wrong -- chico781, 23:34:20 03/01/06 Wed [1]
You need to do this for yourself so that you're at peace with all of this, no matter what that brings. I wish you all the luck in the world and use this as a growing experience.
Sergio
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Re: love gone wrong -- lakemnitz, 07:15:17 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Wow! That is all I can say.....Twan you do give great advice. I loved what you said about the feeling being cowardice.
Chrys-I feel a lot like you in many ways about opening up. Even on this forum. I re-read what I wrote, ask myself does this make sense, who is going to think I am stupid.
I was or still am in a similar situation except that this person is in a very bad relationship and wants to leave but is pretty confused about the whole thing. I won't get involved with him while he is in it because I know how I would feel being the other person....no matter how bad the relationship is.
The last time we talked was about a month ago and I was pretty upset with him because some things happened between us, and it sounded like he was definitely going to get out and all of the sudden he says we are going to try counseling. This by the way was after I left him a very steamy message...I felt like a fucking idiot for allowing this to happen again. Not like it is wrong for him to go the counseling route....if the relationship is worth saving then go for it but don't get involved with someone else in the process....oops that is where my part in it is.
This was superbowl sunday and I was supposed to go over to some friends eat and watch the game so I said I had to go. Anyhow I was pissed that I didn't let him know how I felt so I called him back and left him a message telling him that I felt like a fucking idiot, and that if he still loves her then he needs to be committed to making this work, and not to set up the counseling for failure before they even start. He said that maybe she is just doing this to appease me well yeah that is what I think but I was not going to be the one to tell him that he needs to figure this out on his own.
So now we haven't talked and I feel like shit. We have known each other for quite a while (6 Years) and we discovered that we have a lot in common, same values, loves music, reading, movies, nature all of that. He loves going to shows...I feel like not only have a lost a potential soul mate but I have lost a friend in the process because there is no turning back now and it sucks.
I have left him a couple of messages over the last month asking how things are going, what is going on etc and he won't return my calls......part of me understands this because maybe he actually took what I said seriously about being committed to making things work and is trying to do that.
I'll write more later....I am going to be late for work. I have been asking myself a lot of deep questions lately and forgot that you guys have given me some of the best feedback I have ever had so.....talk later.
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Re: love gone wrong -- alicemudgarden, 08:11:09 03/02/06 Thu [1]
So glad I stumbled upon this thread. I read it all last night and thought about posting. It had me really thinking because I am going through the same thing right now myself.
As hard as I have been trying to keep my feelings in check I am losing the battle.
Anyway, the guy I am developing feelings for dropped this bomb on me yesterday: The ex called and she is pregnant! :0
I allowed myself to hold back and was stewing all night.
Anyway, reading all Chrys & Mr. 23 had to say prompted me to make the call.
So thanks to Twan & Chrys because I felt so much better after calling him and saying what was on my mind.
Twan what you said about the "cowardice" feelings will forever stick with me. Words of wisdom my friend!
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Re: love gone wrong -- lump, 08:55:54 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Alice - OMG! That's a nightmare. I'm sorry, honey, that you're going through something like that.
Chrys....you're going to want to shoot me. DO NOT write it in a letter and give it to him. Writing it down to get your shit straight is great. Giving him a letter for something so heartfelt is bad. I know it takes an amazing amount of balls but you NEED to actually physically tell him what you want to say. You're taking this letter and wittling it down and down like a songwriter. Sometimes the original (and you know this) feeling gets lost. You need to TELL him. You need reaction. You need the confidence that comes from having the balls to SAY it. Otherwise, you don't get an immediate reaction. You don't get questions. You'll spend however long it takes him to reply beating yourself up and wondering.
Plus, and trust me on this one, later on...you'll be embarrassed about that letter. My bf kept all my letters. He loves them. I find them pitiful and am embarassed by them. And they bring me back to a place I wouldn't be anymore.
You're a good writer - it's your strength - but trust me on this one...you need to take advantage of this situation for your heart and just tell him face to face.
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 09:06:34 03/02/06 Thu [1]
"(are you calling me gay?)"
~~~ You are definetly intouch with your feminine side.
J/K
Why would you have to be gay to give great advice on love.
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 09:18:51 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Yeah RON-E That sucks!!
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Re: love gone wrong -- carson1, 11:53:08 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Yep, Chrys, I agree with Twan. He may be backing off because he thinks that's what you want. Just talk to him...tell him what he means to you. Take a chance, doll :)!
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 12:01:14 03/02/06 Thu [1]
hmmm, now i'm unsure. you and one other person said the same thing, and on the other hand other people are telling me that since i am having trouble getting ahold of him, the letter is the way to go. i tried very hard in the letter to just boil things down to bare bones, not to do the songwriter thing, lol. more like how i wrote the original post on this thread (but much shorter). i think you're right we need the face to face interaction and i'm terrified of that, but i'm still unsure. maybe i will go over there and if he is there, talk face to face and if he is not, leave the letter, and therefore let fate decide, lol. still fel incredibly uncomfortable about the idea of even going over there, like i think it's rude. still not totally sure i should even do it. he needs his own damn phone, damnit.
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Re: love gone wrong -- lump, 12:05:44 03/02/06 Thu [1]
You banged him for crying out loud. Going over there is no big deal! Maybe you're really afraid you'll find something you don't want to see.
And boiling down to bare bones = editing. You're editing yourself. Cut dat shit out. :)
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 12:13:40 03/02/06 Thu [1]
ron-e - how did things turn out? i'm glad you're glad you made the call. and don't thank me, i'm a coward, lol.
and yes that sentence about cowardice sooo hit home, i will remember that forever too.
lake - that whole thing does not sound fun. i just wanted to address one thing most importantly. you said "I won't get involved with him while he is in it because I know how I would feel being the other person....no matter how bad the relationship is." - don't downplay how you feel being you, either. what i mean is, it feels crappy on all ends, usually, and don't disregard your own feelings. i think not getting too involved is a good idea b/c it sounds like the guy is real wishy washy with you both, and not seriously committing to anything. i know that it sucks though.
is this "love gone wrong" season or what?
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 12:21:35 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Yes, Lake I forgot to say something to you. I think that guy is playing bigtime games. I would try and forget about him. I know it's hard because he's been your friend also, but try to get him out of your head.
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 12:23:31 03/02/06 Thu [1]
lol it means not saying the same thing over and over and over...have you read my posts? lol. i can show you if you want, lol.
maybe that's true lump, but i also just feel like it's rude. i don't think it is something i have ever done EVER, not even w/a real close friend, and if someone just came over here uninvited i would prob. think it was semi rude too, even if it was him. you guys don't think that is just totally socially wrong? i am trying to think of even one person who i would feel okay doing that with, but i can't think of anyone. hell i didn't feel comf. at camp going over other camp houses uninvited, unplanned, w/o calling first or having made plans.
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 12:37:58 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Are you talking to me? I did read your post and that's why I needed to respond to Lake, with my own two cents, even if it means nothing. I didn't earlier because I had to do something and I meant to comeback and tell her that. We actually talked on the phone once and she told me about this guy. Anyway I know alot of the times we are all saying the samething, just different wording.
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Re: love gone wrong -- lump, 13:23:17 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Try on his shoes honey. If you broke someone's heart and maybe just didn't know it, wouldn't you want them (especially if they're completely special like yourself) to come tell you? I can see popping in unexpected on friends as being rude. BUT this is IMPORTANT. This is your heart.
I'm not calling you a coward nor would I. I'm saying that not being brave when it comes to matters like this has been my regret. Be brave so that it's not yours too.
I have read your posts, and your personality comes out so strongly in them - which is what makes a good writer. Editing yourself (or boiling it down to the bone) may make it more clear, but it takes the stage away from you.
You're a fantastic girl and you have alot to offer. Hold up your head and go get 'em.
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Re: love gone wrong -- alicemugarden, 13:58:21 03/02/06 Thu [1]
Quick update on my situation.
Aside from what is going on with his ex and if she is pregnant or not. He has assured me that he will not go back to that situation. He broke it off for a reason and the reason is still very fresh in his mind.
Now my side of things.... my feelings were hurt, of course, but this is a new day and after talking to him, (I think it is looking into those beautiful blue eyes), I am ready to just go with the flow. I am a firm believer in people coming into our lives for a reason. It feels so good to be around him, and touch him and all that wishy-washy stuff; so I am NOT going to deny myself that pleasure!!
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 17:05:19 03/02/06 Thu [1]
oh god, i know, lump. i may just walk over there b/c if i don't i may puke. haha taking the stage away, you should see what talking does to me. i can write anything but i can't talk. the woman i am sorta helping write a book is the complete opposite. she can say anything in the world but give her a pen and paper and she freaks.
fuck i need to stop making excuses and go over there. he once told me i was welcome there anytime, i just never take that shit seriously, lol.
but i can't torture myself forever. well, i could try, i'm pretty proficient at it. i know in my heart of hearts beneath the fear that i want to go over there, and that i need to right some wrongs.
deep breath, maybe i will go. lol i'm trying to think of ten "as scary" things i've done in my life.
it is the TALKING i'm afraid of, kind alike i write stuff for class and i just CANT read it out loud, not even w/the group i have known for years who knows everything about me, and like i said once i'm much more afraid of talking about sex than i ever was of doing it, lol. it is not even so much the result i'm afraid of as the actual speaking.
think i gotta just get it over with...or not.
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 18:57:36 03/02/06 Thu [1]
well two updates...
first, he called earlier, when i was at my peak oil meeting (which sucked). i didn't even check my caller ID till hours after i got home and when i saw his as the most recent call i was like OMG (also have some strange number that keeps calling and missing me, from eastern WA, weird, it doesn't come w/a name so no clue who it is).
also, RIGHT now i'm getting ready to go over there. gonna try calling one last time before i go over (and if i talk to him i'm going to say i'm going to come over, lol).
will let you know how it turns out.
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Re: love gone wrong -- tg, 19:42:24 03/02/06 Thu [1]
He's thinking about you, he's probably wondering what happened to my lover. Get your butt over there girlie!
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Re: love gone wrong -- Robert, 20:25:25 03/02/06 Thu [1]
When he started telling you deeply personal things about himself, it probably got very weird for him. Guys don't do that unless they love you.
I think you still have a shot if you want it...but you're trying too hard Chrys. Ease back a bit and put the ball in his court. He'll come around.
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Re: love gone wrong -- lakemnitz, 06:55:10 03/03/06 Fri [1]
Can't wait to hear what happens Chrys! I know it will work out for you and lump was right you have a lot to offer, and you are worth taking this risk for yourself.
Now me on the other hand....TG might be right because I have no idea what is keeping him there, they have had some pretty fucked up things happen in their relationship and I have wondered over the years why he stays.....personally I think that he has a serious self esteem issue but the reason I think that is he said to me one night on the phone something about why would I want to be with someone who is balding.....I was like ummmm first of all I really didn't notice that much and second that really doesn't matter that much to me.
For whatever reason she has him hooked in this sickness...and I am not sure what it is but I know I stayed in my marriage for a while and wondering what I was going to do for some time and put myself and my sobriety at some pretty serious risk. I am a little concerned about that for him too. She used to be sober but all of the sudden in the past year has started drinking again and a lot; to the point where she doesn't come home, doesn't call and makes up a lot of excuses. Last summer she spend $15K on god knows what (she gambles too).....he has been sober for a while now but I also know how that goes I have been in the mode of "well if you can't beat'em join 'em." That is how the cocaine abuse started with me....
Speaking of gambling my ex or soon to be called me last night and fessed up to why he has not been paying me.....he lost a shit load of money gambling! He started crying and telling me he didn't know what to do about it and he thinks he has a problem, begged me not to turn my back on him. I was like go to GA, acknowledge your problem, get past the shame because I cannot help you. Man I am so glad that this is not part of my daily life anymore.....he fucking owes everyone money, and I asked him is this the life you want for yourself? He asked me if I regretted leaving and I really didn't think it was totally appropriate for me to drive the nail in deeper and just said I don't think that is a fair question for me to answer...duh! No of course I don't regret it! That coupled with all of the verbal abuse I am relieved to get out....I have gotten my life back on track and have things to look forward to.
Man relationships are hard.....why do we make them so?
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 15:39:22 03/03/06 Fri [1]
just got back!
okay well i was still sorta chicken, but at least i went over there. he was sleeping when i got there but the other guys woke him up. he came out and was quiet for a bit but then like, hey let me show you how i rearranged my room, so i went upstairs w/him. we talked for awhile, and i tried to bring up that week that he was here and how things were weird and he was like oh don't worry about it, just blowing it off almost. maybe he doesn't want to talk about that stuff, i don't know. it's like neither of us knows how to talk. so then after awhile we watched a movie and of course had to keep pausing it to talk. awhile after that ended we went downstairs and hung out w/the other guys in the house and some other dudes that had come over....me and six dudes, lol, it was great. my guy was a great host, making sure when we all had food at like midnight that i got some first, and so on. so then eventually he was like i'm gonna go watch a movie and in my head i'm like umm is that my cue to leave or what so i asked can i watch w/you and he said yeah of course, and i was like okay. got back to his room and realized he had arranged it for both us to sleep there (which was not easy or comfortable, his room is really tiny) and then we put in the movie after talking for a bit and he fell asleep (he ALWAYS sleeps more than i do, every single time). i kept waking up w/him halfway on top of me or w/his arm draped around my neck, lol. that space is not meant for two people, but it worked, and it was really really nice to sleep next to him. it's so comforting. it was funny like the moment he fell asleep he started like, putting his leg and arm on me. it all felt really good.
in the morning the same guy came in to wake him up cuz they had to go get paid for a job, so we had to get ready to go real fast and they gave me a ride home just now. all evening i kept thinking about i should give him the letter before i go, but then we were going and i didn't want to give it to him in front of the other guy.
so all in all, i'm still chicken shit, but at least i went over there. i also paid a lot of attention even when i was there, to like, not hold back as much, to tell him i appreciate things and to talk about my own life, and so on.
btw he didn't seem to think it was rude at all that i came over, lol.
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Re: love gone wrong -- lump, 17:04:39 03/03/06 Fri [1]
SEE??? Maybe he was freaking out because you never went there to see him?
Anyhow, your issue might not be solved, but you're not as uncomfortable in his space now, right?
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Re: love gone wrong -- chrys, 17:48:56 03/03/06 Fri [1]
omg i feel better than i have in weeks. i felt better ever since writing down the letter, and then also this morning i found out my friend is finally coming home on sunday, and my writing group will start meeting again on a week from monday, and last night just felt like total comfort, i felt so well taken care of, really by everyone in that house, prob cuz i'm female lol, but esp by my guy. when he found out later, after we ate at midnight, that i hadn't eaten anything since noon he was like omg you should have told me i'm a bad host lol and i was like noooo.
so yes the issue is not totally solved but at least i went over there, and i really feel so much better that i have in soooo long. and i never even would have considered going over there if it weren't for you guys so i'm glad y'all talked me into it. and i will not forget that there is still work to do and things to clear up.
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Re: love gone wrong -- lakemnitz, 08:34:29 03/04/06 Sat [1]
Way to go Chrys! Conquered the fear.....
My friend called me too yesterday......things are pretty fucked up at home worse than before. He is moving out in two weeks; they were supposed to start counseling but she doesn't think that she needs it so he decided to go on his own. But I was right about the if you can't beat 'em join 'em thing....he started smoking dope again. Man that is two friends of mine in the last month that have relapsed!
Anyhow....we talked for a while and I am not doing anything right now. I need to be careful as I do not want to feel used or hurt again.
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